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| Thread: OMG! Farrah Fawcett and Michael Jackson died! |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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blizzardboy
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posted June 26, 2009 11:01 PM |
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Michael Jackson was the king of pop around the world. Who cares about the French?
One was an entertainer. The other one is largely responsible for you living as openly and prosperously as you are right now. In short, it gave you the freedom to be as disrespectfully unappreciative as you are being. The French revolution impacted a lot more than just France.
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Lexxan
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Unimpressed by your logic
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posted June 26, 2009 11:02 PM |
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Edited by Lexxan at 23:05, 26 Jun 2009.
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Listen, I didn't like Jackson either, and I believe he was guilty of pedophilia (a subjective opion of mine), but all of this doesn't matter anymore.
His pedophilia was not proven (and there is a decent chance that he was innocent), and his songs were good, as far I can state that in an objective manner. (though it a Major overstatement to call his songs a "Great Cultural Achievement"... They remain songs nontheless.) Fact.
He has passed away, because of a heart attack, presumably caused by an overdosis Morphine/Medicines. Why the trolling, Flaming or Fighting about someone who has died? Grant the Dead their rest, please.
Whatever your toughts are on Jackson, they remain subjective. Share them if you must, but discussing them is pointless.
To conclude, I was saddened by his death - He was one of the best Entertainers of the 20th century.
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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mvassilev
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posted June 26, 2009 11:05 PM |
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What is a great cultural achievement? Can you define?
I can't define it, but I can give examples. Bach's music is a cultural achievement - MJ's isn't. The Palace of Versailles is a cultural achievement - Le Corbusier's buildings aren't. "1984" is a cultural achievement - "The Outsiders" isn't.
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Corribus
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posted June 26, 2009 11:07 PM |
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I pretty much agree with everything Blizzard said in his post at the top of the page.
Whether you like the direction of music in the second half of the 20th century or not is immaterial. It's undeniable that Jackson had a major influence on the course of music, and - for better or worse - he heavily influenced pop culture. It's pointless and unfair to try to take that away from him.
That said, he was also a near-lunatic for pretty much the last decade and he didn't really contribute anything to anything since the peak of his fame. His passing is sad for the reason that most deaths are sad, but it's certainly not "OMG SO TRAGIC" and I certainly don't think it deserves the hundreds of orgasmic news stories and gushing, overinflated TV specials that are inevitable in the next couple weeks.
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blizzardboy
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posted June 26, 2009 11:07 PM |
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@ Lexxan: He's dead. He doesn't care if people criticize him.
I don't see why you find it odd that this conversation is going on. Michael Jackson was as very controversial figure and there's a lot of people that (rightfully) didn't like various things that he did.
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Totoro
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posted June 26, 2009 11:08 PM |
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Edited by Totoro at 23:13, 26 Jun 2009.
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One was an entertainer. The other one is largely responsible for you living as openly and prosperously as you are right now. In short, it gave you the freedom to be as disrespectfully unappreciative as you are. The French revolution impacted a lot more than just France.
I was talking about the tower, it is merely a symbol of centennial celebration of the revolution. The tower has not affected me in any way. Wiping off the tower won't wipe off civil rights.
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I can't define it, but I can give examples. Bach's music is a cultural achievement - MJ's isn't. The Palace of Versailles is a cultural achievement - Le Corbusier's buildings aren't. "1984" is a cultural achievement - "The Outsiders" isn't.
Can you tell me why is Bach's music cultural achievement, but not MJ's? Because it's alot older and has gathered more value?
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Lexxan
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Unimpressed by your logic
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posted June 26, 2009 11:09 PM |
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Whether it deserves it or not, his passing is going to be exploited by the Media. There's not way to stop it
*sigh*
Celebrities are so overrated, when it comes to cultural value...
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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pandora
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posted June 26, 2009 11:15 PM |
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Edited by pandora at 23:18, 26 Jun 2009.
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The media machine is what it is Corribus, they will spend a celebrity's lifetime tearing them down, only to erect glorious shrines to them after they pass away.
In my opinion, a lot of people are reacting out of shock - because this was one. When Heath Ledger passed away, it was a similar reaction, disbelief followed by "too soon!"
If a person can't really recognize what Michael Jackson represents to music, it doesn't matter to me at all. Its not going to change my feelings or opinions.
What disgusts me here, is that people feel the need to stroll in and try to upset people because they can.
There's no need for the kind of posts that have been made here - except to provoke people.
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"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."
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Totoro
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posted June 26, 2009 11:19 PM |
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Edited by Totoro at 23:38, 26 Jun 2009.
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It is in terms of his fundamental emotions—i.e., the emotions produced by his own metaphysical value-judgements—that man responds to music.
Music cannot tell a story, it cannot deal with concretes, it cannot convey a specific existential phenomenon, such as a peaceful countryside or a stormy sea. The theme of a composition entitled “Spring Song” is not spring, but the emotions which spring evoked in the composer. Even concepts which, intellectually, belong to a complex level of abstraction, such as “peace,” “revolution,” “religion,” are too specific, too concrete to be expressed in music. All that music can do with such themes is convey the emotions of serenity, or defiance, or exaltation. Liszt’s “St. Francis Walking on the Waters” was inspired by a specific legend, but what it conveys is a passionately dedicated struggle and triumph—by whom and in the name of what, is for each individual listener to supply.
Music communicates emotions, which one grasps, but does not actually feel; what one feels is a suggestion, a kind of distant, dissociated, depersonalised emotion—until and unless it unites with one’s own sense of life. But since the music’s emotional content is not communicated conceptually or evoked existentially, one does feel it in some peculiar, subterranean way.
Music conveys the same categories of emotions to listeners who hold widely divergent views of life. As a rule, men agree on whether a given piece of music is gay or sad or violent or solemn. But even though, in a generalized way, they experience the same emotions in response to the same music, there are radical differences in how they appraise this experience—i.e., how they feel about these feelings.
Isn't this the case in whatever music? Is this trying to define music? Because it certainly isn't defining culture. Are you trying to prove that Michael Jackson didn't make music, but mess of sounds that couldn't convey feelings that people could experience in different ways?
Quote:
Who cares about Michael Jackson?
I do, but I don't give a rat's ass about France's independence day. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.
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pandora
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posted June 26, 2009 11:20 PM |
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You realize that you're not stating fact, right?
That's just your opinion.
*sigh* Only in the OSM...
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Salamandre
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posted June 26, 2009 11:23 PM |
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Art is not an inherently positive force for society.
Art is about everything that gives us closest answers than the science. One can discuss here and say intelligent things for years, he may be surprised his sentences do not touch anyones heart. Art is raising questions about our true nature, our destiny, our limits. Art is also about illogical ideas, but they were contributing to major changes into history. Logic is right but not emotional. Emotion is what punch your soul and make you learn from your acts. It happens that MJ touch deeply millions of souls and that is what it counts at the end. There is no need to compare him to Bach or architectural achievements, unless you try to start again a "intelligent" argue, which is pointless. Millions of people are praising him because he inspired them in a way or another. If you call them "bad taste" and idiots, don't be surprised the be called desensitized and dead inside in return. To each one his arguments.
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blizzardboy
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posted June 26, 2009 11:43 PM |
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@Sal: I think you're mixing me up with Mvass some because I never compared him to Bach or other achievements.
Jackson touched a lot of people in his life, in more ways than one, so I won't argue that. Art is by definition expression, so I don't really think you can call it illogical or logical; it's not applicable to it's purpose. What I care about isn't whether Jackson touched people; it's whether he touched them in a good way. Did he inspire them to be better than they currently are? Or did he inspire them to dance a bunch and become more shallow? I think he mostly did the later, and I think that's what a lot of art serves today. Not that I condemn that outright, since I admit when I listen to music it's mostly just because it sounds cool. But at the same time, I don't pretend that it serves some sort of lofty purpose in society.
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Fauch
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posted June 27, 2009 12:00 AM |
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Edited by Fauch at 00:02, 27 Jun 2009.
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I saw something funny at the tv. people feeling the urge to buy his cds. wth? is it their way to respect the dead? 
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Clay_Man
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posted June 27, 2009 12:27 AM |
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Edited by Clay_Man at 00:28, 27 Jun 2009.
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Stop posting your personal opinion as if you think it's fact.
I hope you don't mind this little addition William 
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lord_crusader
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UHU!! supreme!
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posted June 27, 2009 01:16 AM |
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man... this is so... how can I call it??
well... is like you are dancing in the grave of death person... maybe you can't find michael family's here... but Im sure there are people that grow up with his music and get inspiration to be a better person thanks to him, and they does feel appreciation for him... you can be no related to him... but there are other people that does... you just need to respect them...
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Cepheus
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posted June 27, 2009 01:29 AM |
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And ellipses. Gotta respect ellipses.
Well I'm not a Jacko fan, but I always... what's the word... we'll say "liked" Thriller, regardless of its present cheesiness. I do seriously respect that he was able to create a 14-minute long music video and get away with it. Nobody else would
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TheDeath
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with serious business
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posted June 27, 2009 01:50 AM |
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Would Michael Jackson be worth even 10% without "Thriller"? 
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william
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posted June 27, 2009 01:55 AM |
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Yes. He made other hits such as "Bad", "Beat It", "Billie Jean", "The Way You Make Me Feel", "Smooth Criminal", "Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough" etc. 
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Mytical
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posted June 27, 2009 06:28 AM |
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I won't comment on what I think about the people who hate something because it was 'popular'. Besides to say they are less then the individuals they think they are.
I will say, like what you like. It doesn't matter if it is 'commercialized' or 'underground' or only 3 people in the whole world have even heard of it. If you enjoy music, don't let anybody (society or whatever) decide what you listen to. That is off topic however.
Ok Michael Jackson is no Bach, or Mozart. Like Elvis, however, he changed the face of music. He opened a lot of doors for African-Americans, rock, and influenced MOST of them music you listen to that came after that time. His personal life (which nothing was proved, and it is innocent until PROVEN guilty) has NO bearing on his accomplishments. He could have been an alien from Xixna 7 and it still would not have ANY bearing on his music.
You are free to like whatever music you like, and you are free to think that Michael didn't change anything. Don't try to trick a trickster however. Michael for good or bad made a huge impact on the worlds music. That you are even bothering to post in here if you don't like him proves it. You KNOW ABOUT HIM, even if you don't like him. He has been relitively out of music for about 20ish years..that is saying a lot that YOU KNOW ABOUT HIM.
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Azagal
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posted June 27, 2009 07:30 AM |
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It's just noise. Compared to Bach, at least.
I don't really get it. I mean you're obviously just posting to piss people off. There is absolutely nothing more than provocation to a couple of your posts in here. What for? So you can see the hardcore fans like Toto argue you to death only so you can go one another tangent?
You don't like his music that's fine, you don't think he was an artist, that's fine aswell but is claiming he's a monkey or other equally intelligent remark every freakin page how you have a meaningful discussion?
Actually I see no discussion I only see you and thedeath (sorry for being so biased, I have no idea why I pick you of all people) being the devils advocat. All you do is say "no" to piss people off and then you just go on. What the hell? It's really annoying oO.
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