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Heroes Community > Heroes 6 - The New Beginning > Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~
Thread: ~ Heroes 6 - Discussion thread ~ [ This thread is 525 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 (161) 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 ]
Nelgirith
Nelgirith


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted February 10, 2011 02:45 PM
Edited by Nelgirith at 14:47, 10 Feb 2011.

Quote:
Stronghold's creatures were seen in screenshots before they were revealed too. If I remember right, these screenshots weren't leaked. I could be mistaken though.

You must have been daydreaming. We've seen the Stronghold creatures once they appeared on various websites for the official announcement of the 4th faction.

Quote:
Even hints can be given here and there all the time, an official reveal can still be made later. The Dragon Eel for examples was shown before the word that we got Bosses got out.

You have really bad memory The Dragon Eel appeared in the Igromir video which Ubisoft removed. There have been a few hints about the Dragon Eel in some Q&A (like the fact he was a boss and that he had a 2x8 size) but nothing else until the artwork on the official website.

EDIT: He was actually the first boss announced.

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evinin
evinin


Supreme Hero
Servant of Asha
posted February 10, 2011 02:48 PM

About the screenshot - really interesting. I don't think that we have Water elemental (IMO it's a Spirit or it even looks like a Ghost). I'm not sure for Fire elementals (because of the Inferno units) but there is definitely a Earth element or something like that.
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admira
admira


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 10, 2011 02:53 PM

@kordial: the problem with spring/river spirit is not only the similarities with Glories. Having a snow lady and the spirit at the same tier most probably having similar role seems not right (to be specific: Overidding). I mean, Water Spirit and Ice Spirit, they are on the same tier too. I think that is the point of all the negativity towards river spirit.

There are more water creature like Dragon Turtle, or Hermit ridding a large tortoise found in many Far East painting, which will give more variety on the line-ups that can fill the role.

However, there is no confirmation and nothing is set in stone yet (unlike Glories). So everything can (still) happen.

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kodial79
kodial79


Promising
Supreme Hero
How'd Phi's Lov't
posted February 10, 2011 02:53 PM
Edited by kodial79 at 14:56, 10 Feb 2011.

Nope, if you remember right, at the old site there were a video before Igromir, that showed you the intro to the Dragon Eel, a Haven to Necropolis conversion among other things. And I remember, many people saying this to be the Water Elemental back then. We didn't know it was called Dragon Eel and that it was a Boss (although that part, some of us guessed) for quite some time then.

As for the Stronghold screenshots, though they did come with the general faction's announcement but so what? The creatures appeared before their own specific reveals.

@Alcibiades
Wait, what you're saying that this is not the same creature that we saw on the leaked artwork of the fifth faction? Wether it changed or not?
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Maeerol
Maeerol


Hired Hero
posted February 10, 2011 03:05 PM
Edited by maeerol at 15:10, 10 Feb 2011.

I see three fire elementals(A, B and C[maybe, earth elementals with a lava or magma background), and a river spirit, from the naga faction... at least, it's just like one we saw in the artwork.

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vitorsly
vitorsly


Known Hero
Joker!
posted February 10, 2011 03:28 PM
Edited by vitorsly at 15:29, 10 Feb 2011.

Maybe they dint saw her there? Probably not.
Well I make a promise here: If it is said to be a clue to the fifth faction before monday by a Dev OR 2 insiders I will sing this song to my girlfriend in valentines day:
'Cyclops are strong
Goblins are weak
Your as preety as a fury
Except you dont have a beak'
How do you like it

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SwampLord
SwampLord


Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
posted February 10, 2011 03:48 PM
Edited by SwampLord at 15:50, 10 Feb 2011.

I think those are the elementals; I doubt the Spring Spirit was dropped this late in development, but who knows?

I would be glad if they replaced either that or the Ice Maiden (especially with a HIII Fortress creature ) but I seriously doubt they would be dropped this late.
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They can take my swamp, they can take my town, but they will never take my FREEDOM!

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WitchHunter
WitchHunter


Adventuring Hero
Problem Drinker
posted February 10, 2011 04:05 PM

I've seen the tree. Most of the faces were Sanctuary creatures though, the other ones were the Spectre, Glory, Sister and Succubus I believe. I forgot the rest though.
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I'm taking my talents to South Beach. I'm leaving my brain in Cleveland though.

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted February 11, 2011 12:22 AM

I have an opinion!

I find the fact to be very good. If this means they have different levels of strength for the elementals, I'm think it's a positive change from Heroes 5 where the elementals was boring.

However if it should turn out that the elementals have the same level and and at the same time VERY different sizes then I can say I'm disappointed...
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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Aosaw
Aosaw


Promising
Famous Hero
Author of Nonreal Fiction
posted February 11, 2011 12:35 AM

Personally, I'm glad the earth elemental is finally getting some love.  I felt downright jilted every time I cast Summon Elemenatls and got stuck with Earth.

Or air, for that matter.  It seemed like Water Elementals and Fire Elementals were more powerful by a significant margin, which didn't seem fair (particularly when you were summoning them all with the same spell...)

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Jabanoss
Jabanoss


Promising
Legendary Hero
Property of Nightterror™
posted February 11, 2011 12:50 AM

Quote:
Elementals should be all the same strength at all time for the sake of the universum.

Earth Elementals are very big and can regenerate but water elementals have much stronger spells and abilities that make up for that.

All 4 elements are equally deadly.

I also hate this in D&D where the air elementals are level 10 while fire, earth and water elementals are level 11...

AIR IS JUST AS POWERFUL AS EARTH AND FIRE... really they should all be alike no matter the size.

It is not that I feel that a certain element should be weaker then the other, I just hate when there has to be a certain balance.
Especially when it comes to neutral units. For example you could say that in the universe there are many different elementals from the same element but in the game there is only one of the forms.
____________
"You turn me on Jaba"
- Meroe

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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted February 11, 2011 04:15 AM

Personally I'd take the EE from H5, give it Armoured, and maybe raise it's Magic Proof ability to 75%, plus the Immunity To Slow ability.

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alcibiades
alcibiades

Hero of Order
and Light
posted February 11, 2011 07:24 AM

I think the different elementals should deffinitely be of same level, just different characteristics. After all, there is no "strongest" element, they are just different.

Earth is obviously about being hard and durable, so I don't have any problem with the Earth "tank" from previous games, as long as they don't make him entirely useless, as in H5.

Air is obviously the opposit, so Air elemental as flying and incorporeal makes best sense to me.

Water is about adaptivity and change, so Water as a spellcaster also seems a good fit.

Fire is about destruction, so making Fire an offensive unit with high damage seems a good fit.

I don't necessarily see how Fire needs to be ranged, though, in fact it might even be counterintuitive, seing how Fire only grows linearly, so they could make Fire elemental melee and Earth ranged. This would also help with balance, because making Earth slow and tanky and ranged will present an interesting dilemma, because you will have to close in on him to take him out, but he'll be very tough and durable.
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Heroes 7 - News overview | Heroes 7 - Discussion thread

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kodial79
kodial79


Promising
Supreme Hero
How'd Phi's Lov't
posted February 11, 2011 07:42 AM
Edited by kodial79 at 07:42, 11 Feb 2011.

I think that it fits an Earth Elemental to be bigger in size than the other three, without that necesserily making it stronger than them.

Earth elemental is supposed to be reminiscent of something slow moving but sure to get there and smash the hell out of everything. The size can emphasize this.


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MattII
MattII


Legendary Hero
posted February 11, 2011 07:55 AM
Edited by MattII at 08:03, 11 Feb 2011.

Nah, no bigger, but a lot tougher (the other elementals get more special abilites to make up for the EE's sheer toughness).

Oh, and here's what I think would be a good addition for the FE, Each creature generates a Fireball on death (Advanced, 4 power).

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted February 11, 2011 08:05 AM

I'd say:

Air, ranged.
Water, caster.
Fire, melee.
Earth, tanky.

Presuming there will be elementals also for the other two primary schools of magic:
Light, support caster with a ranged attack.
Darkness, debuff aura melee unit.

IF (big if) there is an Primordial aligned elemental, I suspect it will be a well rounded champion strength unit.
But I don't think that's in, I'm feeling confident about light and darkness elementals though.

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soul_blighter
soul_blighter


Adventuring Hero
posted February 11, 2011 08:12 AM

probably right about the primordial element.a consideration for the future maybe.wondering what SOTD is in store for us today

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Paiazza
Paiazza


Known Hero
لىخ ضل
posted February 11, 2011 08:15 AM

This is how I think it should be:

Air Elemental, 3/4 damage, 2/4 hp, weak melee attack - tornado attack that knocks back all enemies in close range, medium ranged attack - lightning strike, fast movement flyer

Earth Elemental, 1/4 damage, 4/4 hp, strong melee attack - strike with his hand, weak ranged attack - pulls the earth as spikes beneath opponent usable once every 3 turns, slow movement walker

Fire Elemental, 4/4 damage, 1/4 hp, strong melee attck - blaze the enemy 3 tiles breath like attack, fast movement teleporter

Water Elemental, 2/4 damage, 3/4 hp, medium caster, ice spikes(1 target) and ring of frost(multiple targets), medium movement walker

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DoubleDeck
DoubleDeck


Promising
Legendary Hero
Look into my eyes...
posted February 11, 2011 08:54 AM

Quote:
Quote:
What makes you say that this is not the Spring Spirit? Only the fact that it's not supposed to be revealed yet?

That, and the fact that I think this creature looks more masculine in the stance and body shape - but that's kind of difficult to say for sure given quality.


This is why I think the creature is a Water Elemental:

1. The Dragon Eel (boss) has taken the shape of the H5 water elemental so the new H6 water elemenetal needs to be different.

2. The creature does look like the River Spirit but that leaked screenshot has not been officially released, besides the creature looks see-through but the River Spirit is clearly solid (well liquid with water) but not see-through.

3. The creature is guarding a Blue Orb. This Orb looks like something to do with Magic and we have the 7 new schools of magic so should be Water (Water = Blue). I mentioned in previous thread that these Orbs would be different colours for the different Magic schools. I reckon the elementals will be closely linked to the Magic of the elemental school as they are bringing this in to H6 now....

4. For the 1st time they have released Elementals in screenshots, not Naga, but Elemental. We see the Earth Elemental, and what we think is the Fire Elemental too. So this is the Water Elemental and now we just need to see Air elemental.

This is obviously speculation as none of us know what that creature is, but I doubt it's NAGA.
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There is enough religion in the world to make one hate each other, but not enough to make one love...

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TDL
TDL


Honorable
Famous Hero
The weak suffer. I endure.
posted February 11, 2011 09:28 AM

Elementals, as neutrals, should be devastating forces of nature and NOT meager units. With the new tier system for heroes, it would be only natural that they are called elite neutral units with above-elite skills. To me, the elementals should be renowned not because of their damage durability or what not, but for their control over their specific elements: therefore, they should have a large (or above average) amount of specific abilities, much like (but added to what) Paiazza said.

Then for example a Fire elemental would have around 6-7 abilities (fire immunity, weakness to cold, fire shield, wall of fire (attacks all adjacent units), line of fire (invokable line of fire 3-5 tiles in front of the fire elemental, damaging everyone in the way), explosion (dies causing an area explosion), etc.

Or something like that. As I see it, they should follow the saying: don't mess with the power of nature.
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Reality is just a warped placeholder for (our) imagination.

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