|
|
dark-whisperer
Famous Hero
Darkness feels no mercy
|
posted September 15, 2011 10:48 AM |
|
|
I have a problem dueling Necro might hero.
I'm playing with Stronghold might hero and I just can't win against it.
Maybe I'm not used to new skill system or I have flaw in my tactic but with counterstrike III, mass drain life, mass stoneskin and so much healing from creatures + necromancy + Death is not the End I just seam unable to kill that many creatures.
I'm not talking about turtling or abusing abilities its just shear number of creatures that my damage cant eliminate fast enough.
Does anybody have more experience with this setup (Necro might vs Stronghold might) to give me some pointers about build and tactic so I can find what the hell I'm doing wrong.
|
|
DoubleDeck
Promising
Legendary Hero
Look into my eyes...
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 11:13 AM |
|
|
Maybe the magic hero's spells do need some tweeking but I like the system:
No magic guild -> What wasn't cool about a magic guild was that the spells held within were random, eg. H5 wizard going for summoning magic and master of conjuration only to find that you received arcane armor and not conjure phoenix! sucks. So it's good that you can choose your spells and reputation of spells too depending on your reputation...
Cooldowns -> This is good so that spells can't be abused eg. H5 warlock casting deep freeze every turn against you can be annoying...what you need to do is get some useful spells and while the one is cooling down, you use the other spells....I think the point is that your spellbook doesn't need many spells, only those that you specialize in (could be a handful) and that's the vibe, specialization of spells....
But yeah, spells need to be made a little more powerful...
|
|
forest001
Known Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 11:24 AM |
|
|
seems some people are really afraid of change (for better or worse  )
some complains seems really unreasonable to me...
like the complain that if you loose castle to opponent he gets an advantage...
isn't this the case in all strategical games that if you lose something you are worse of than your opponent ?
i know you probably meant converting here that gives that much more edge to your opponent, but losing a well developed castle was always quite a hit...
Also i don't quite understand all the whining about forts and area of control... why don't you defend your forts? it's not hard - you can port your defender hero there any time and repel those pesky scouts.
also if say forts are gone what keeps enemy from retaking your remote mines? and how would you defend them?
next want to touch on skills and those 'trees' - it seems a bit monotonous, and there is a good chance for cookie cutter builds, but as long as there is possibility of surprising your opponent with some kind of unusual build it should be fine. i do enjoy the tools we got and that you can combine it in many many ways - which brings me to the next point:
spell cooldowns - if is fab idea, as without it i could imagine horrible things (heal spam, frenzy spam, and what have you), but now it does force you to think more strategically and to be careful what you choose...
think ppl need some time hands on with final product and they will certainly see the light
|
|
Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 11:27 AM |
|
|
Quote:
think ppl need some time hands on with final product and they will certainly see the light
So you're saying we should spend money on something we might not like?
|
|
forest001
Known Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 11:32 AM |
|
|
Quote:
So you're saying we should spend money on something we might not like?
i think there is no way of knowing that you will like it for sure... and this is the case with all games imho.
but if you know you will hate it then save your money i say
|
|
VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 11:54 AM |
|
Edited by VokialBG at 11:59, 15 Sep 2011.
|
Quote:
some complains seems really unreasonable to me...
like the complain that if you loose castle to opponent he gets an advantage...
It is but not that cardinal: 1. you lose population, 2. your enemy get population... from the same type after he converts, and you have to take it back and spend more resources to convet it back... so if are losing at the begining you can turn the tings in your advantage.
Quote:
Also i don't quite understand all the whining about forts and area of control... why don't you defend your forts? it's not hard - you can port your defender hero there any time and repel those pesky scouts.
Yah? You can keep all the forts? When there are like 4 other players and you are in the center? You fight neutral to get the fort, and after few days they are going to take it. You can not beat 4-8 heroes with your 1 mine hero and 1 secundary hero and even few more, you don't have the population to kill all the ****s around you in just few weeks.
But you need forts to build, and you need many forts to not lose population (because forts may give more creatures and because you need mines to build upg creature building - they give more population). So the area thing is going to work fine if we bring back all the resources, this way players are going to need less resources from different types and no more then 1 extra fort to build their first castle. To build your first town now you need like 2-3 extra estates/area/forts... and you can not keep them all easy, some AI is going just convert them, and even when you take them back you need to spent resources to convert them back 
Quote:
spell cooldowns - if is fab idea, as without it i could imagine horrible things (heal spam, frenzy spam, and what have you), but now it does force you to think more strategically and to be careful what you choose...
Don't think so, already said why. Also spells by hero are already to weak for that huge cooldown. Heal casted by level 7-9 Haven hero with tones spell power is going to bring back only few... paladins/sun knights or what ever it's name is and then 4 turns cooldown 
____________
|
|
forest001
Known Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 12:10 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Yah? You can keep all the forts? When there are like 4 other players and you are in the center? You fight neutral to get the fort, and after few days they are going to take it. You can not beat 4-8 heroes with your 1 mine hero and 1 secundary hero and even few more, you don't have the population to kill all the ****s around you in just few weeks.
But you need forts to build, and you need many forts to not lose population (because forts may give more creatures and because you need mines to build upg creature building - they give more population). So the area thing is going to work fine if we bring back all the resources, this way players are going to need less resources from different types and no more then 1 extra fort to build their first castle. To build your first town now you need like 2-3 extra estates/area/forts... and you can not keep them all easy, some AI is going just convert them, and even when you take them back you need to spent resources to convert them back
that just means you can't overstretch or you will get punished, but it's a good thing imo, you need to find a balance between being big and easy to defend, and you can still sabotage enemy in the same way he does to you...
Quote:
Don't think so, already said why. Also spells by hero are already to weak for that huge cooldown. Heal casted by level 7-9 Haven hero with tones spell power is going to bring back only few... paladins/sun knights or what ever it's name is and then 4 turns cooldown
well, it's not like heal is your only spell. you can still cast other stuff in meantime, and i think that on lvl 7-9 those few elites resurrected will be quite significant anyway, and i believe spells are not that weak anyway, even fire magic can grind your army if used at right moment
|
|
alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 12:34 PM |
|
|
About the whole Fort / mine converting thing:
I think the general idea behind the fort is sound: It gives you a way of defending your mines, and it cuts down on micro management. I think both things are good, and the first thing is something previous games really was in need of.
That being said, I agree that they whole "all mines convert to your side" thing when you capture the fort is a bit cheap. I think at least mines should have been visited once for them to be controled by you through the fort. Thus, first time you capture an enemy fort, mines should simply go neutral. That way you have to go locate them and flag them (unless of course you visited before capturing the fort, which let you occupy them but not flag them until fort was captured). On all subsequent fort reconquests, mines should just change side automatically.
In a way, it seems they tried very hard (not sure if it was intentional) to change the game from "Heroes" to "Hero". You don't need secondary heroes to capture mines, you don't need them to transport creatures, only your main hero gains reputation, you always have access to Town Portal ... Not saying all those changes are necessarily bad, but it does change the pace of the game a lot.
____________
What will happen now?
|
|
BlazeHun
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 01:04 PM |
|
|
Quote:
About the whole Fort / mine converting thing:
In a way, it seems they tried very hard (not sure if it was intentional) to change the game from "Heroes" to "Hero". You don't need secondary heroes to capture mines, you don't need them to transport creatures, only your main hero gains reputation, you always have access to Town Portal ... Not saying all those changes are necessarily bad, but it does change the pace of the game a lot.
I disagree. In HoMM 3 you needed just one hero with town portal and you can get all the creatures meanwhile defending all the castles.
Now you have to buy more heroes especially on bigger maps. With just your main hero, you can't win even against normal AI, but with a couple of equally leveled heroes it's easy.
____________
|
|
Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 01:07 PM |
|
|
Another thing that bothers me: A little backstory is nice but holy cow!
Look at this wall of text!
Quote:
Tazar was only thirty-three days old when his parents, merchants from the Wolf Duchy, took the ship in Nilshaven to Strandholm. A terrible storm fell on the ship, and supernatural titanic waves crashed against the frail skiff, opening its hull as if it were a nutshell. His parents died swallowed by the waves, but Tazar survived. He was found on the beach of one of the Pao Islands by a female sabre-toothed Jaguar. Moved by some mysterious animal instinct, she gently took the baby in her maw and raised him as her own. Tazar's first contact with civilisation eventually occurred ten years onward, when a group of Naga poachers killed his "mother". Discovering her skin hanging in the middle of their hunting camp, the boy went berserk and attacked the three Nagas with hands, teeth and rocks. His screams of fury and despair brought forth the attention of some Orcs who had been surveying the interlopers. Amazed by the murderous rage contained within this small Human child, the Orcs came to his help and killed the Nagas. They knocked the feral boy out cold and brought him back to their village, where they patiently tamed him, teaching him the way of life of the Orcs. As the only Human to be considered a Jaguar Warrior to this day, Tazar wears the pelt of his "mother" as a reminder of his origins and as a warning to his enemies.
Compare this to
H4
Quote:
Tazar is a clanless outsider who wanders from clan to clan doing odd jobs for a meal and lodging. Sometimes, he is able to hire out his strong sword arm as well. This is the life he has become accustomed to, although in private he longs to be accepted by one of the tribes.
and H3
Quote:
During a six month border war with Krewlod, a small force led by Tazar was able to make a stand at a Tatalian outpost, holding off a Krewlod force nearly five times their size for more than eight days until reinforcements arrived.
Sorry for the small derail. Back to discussing forts and spells.
|
|
DoubleDeck
Promising
Legendary Hero
Look into my eyes...
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 01:18 PM |
|
|
Quote:
It just occur to me. Talking about resource vs area of control.
They reduced the resource type to facilitate competition in the other hand, the area of control actually make it much more simple a way too much IMHO.
Still how I saw it from my point of view but I think the choice is:
- Remove the Area of Control completely and stay with 4 resource
or
- Bring back the 7 type resource and tweak the Area of Control since now it is easier to manage multiple type of resource with Area of Control in play
Just my opinion and 2 cents though
What I don't vibe with the Area of Control is how it looks more than it's purpose....now everything on the map is in their own little boxes with obelisks as borders.....doesn't feel vast and free like previous heroes games.....
|
|
Nocturnal
Promising
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 01:49 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Another thing that bothers me: A little backstory is nice but holy cow!
Look at this wall of text!
Quote:
Tazar was only thirty-three days old when his parents, merchants from the Wolf Duchy, took the ship in Nilshaven to Strandholm. A terrible storm fell on the ship, and supernatural titanic waves crashed against the frail skiff, opening its hull as if it were a nutshell. His parents died swallowed by the waves, but Tazar survived. He was found on the beach of one of the Pao Islands by a female sabre-toothed Jaguar. Moved by some mysterious animal instinct, she gently took the baby in her maw and raised him as her own. Tazar's first contact with civilisation eventually occurred ten years onward, when a group of Naga poachers killed his "mother". Discovering her skin hanging in the middle of their hunting camp, the boy went berserk and attacked the three Nagas with hands, teeth and rocks. His screams of fury and despair brought forth the attention of some Orcs who had been surveying the interlopers. Amazed by the murderous rage contained within this small Human child, the Orcs came to his help and killed the Nagas. They knocked the feral boy out cold and brought him back to their village, where they patiently tamed him, teaching him the way of life of the Orcs. As the only Human to be considered a Jaguar Warrior to this day, Tazar wears the pelt of his "mother" as a reminder of his origins and as a warning to his enemies.
This story is simply beautiful! How could such a thing bother someone?!
____________
|
|
Gweret
Adventuring Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 02:31 PM |
|
Edited by Gweret at 14:53, 15 Sep 2011.
|
Quote:
all mines and dwellings converts to you, magically.
Also magically, resources appear in your base AND magically are available to ALL of your bases.
In the market, magically buyers appear with UNLIMITED amount of resources.
This is Magical game, after all.
We should try to separate things, we don't like with things which are simply broken.
The most of us will can make a judgment after release. So we will know how this really work.
|
|
Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 02:35 PM |
|
|
Quote:
We should try to separate things, we don't like with things which are simply broken.
This is the main discussion thread, I think there is room enough for both 
|
|
forest001
Known Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 02:40 PM |
|
|
Quote:
This is the main discussion thread, I think there is room enough for both
agree, but still we should be able to tell them apart 
|
|
KingImp
Famous Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 03:47 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Yeah, wolves are cool, but am wondering where the mermaids are? Can't seen them in the demo maps....
Play the Stronghold campaign. I fought Mermaids in that one. And they were on land if I recall correctly. Makes perfect sense. 
|
|
Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 04:04 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Yeah, wolves are cool, but am wondering where the mermaids are? Can't seen them in the demo maps....
Play the Stronghold campaign. I fought Mermaids in that one. And they were on land if I recall correctly. Makes perfect sense.
Stronghold campaigne is not included in the Demo. And fallowing this logic, I have not yet met the wolves anywhare else then in the Slavas intro.
____________
I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
|
|
KingImp
Famous Hero
|
|
posted September 15, 2011 04:09 PM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Yeah, wolves are cool, but am wondering where the mermaids are? Can't seen them in the demo maps....
Play the Stronghold campaign. I fought Mermaids in that one. And they were on land if I recall correctly. Makes perfect sense.
Stronghold campaigne is not included in the Demo. And fallowing this logic, I have not yet met the wolves anywhare else then in the Slavas intro.
Ooops, sorry about that. I missed the word demo and just assumed he was playing the beta.
|
|
GenyaArikado
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted September 16, 2011 04:09 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Quote:
Another thing that bothers me: A little backstory is nice but holy cow!
Look at this wall of text!
Quote:
Tazar was only thirty-three days old when his parents, merchants from the Wolf Duchy, took the ship in Nilshaven to Strandholm. A terrible storm fell on the ship, and supernatural titanic waves crashed against the frail skiff, opening its hull as if it were a nutshell. His parents died swallowed by the waves, but Tazar survived. He was found on the beach of one of the Pao Islands by a female sabre-toothed Jaguar. Moved by some mysterious animal instinct, she gently took the baby in her maw and raised him as her own. Tazar's first contact with civilisation eventually occurred ten years onward, when a group of Naga poachers killed his "mother". Discovering her skin hanging in the middle of their hunting camp, the boy went berserk and attacked the three Nagas with hands, teeth and rocks. His screams of fury and despair brought forth the attention of some Orcs who had been surveying the interlopers. Amazed by the murderous rage contained within this small Human child, the Orcs came to his help and killed the Nagas. They knocked the feral boy out cold and brought him back to their village, where they patiently tamed him, teaching him the way of life of the Orcs. As the only Human to be considered a Jaguar Warrior to this day, Tazar wears the pelt of his "mother" as a reminder of his origins and as a warning to his enemies.
This story is simply beautiful! How could such a thing bother someone?!
You do realize thats TaRzan story, right?
|
|
Aosaw
Promising
Famous Hero
Author of Nonreal Fiction
|
|
posted September 16, 2011 04:51 AM |
|
Edited by Aosaw at 04:53, 16 Sep 2011.
|
No, no, no.
In order for it to be Tarzan, Phil Collins would have to be involved.
Like this?
Uh...yeah. Kind of like that. Although I was personally thinking something more along these lines.
|
| |
|
|
This Super Thread is pages long: 
