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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: Era II
Thread: Era II This Popular Thread is 140 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 30 60 90 120 ... 136 137 138 139 140 · «PREV / NEXT»
Alustor
Alustor


Famous Hero
ooo da :)
posted February 05, 2012 02:19 PM

Quote:
Sounds childish and impractical.


yeah,sound like hobbit to me too

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JimV
JimV


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 03:06 PM

This is probably a bad idea, but I will ask.  For the sake of backward compatibility with existing Era 1.8 maps, would it be possible to restore the functionality of DL "button" items?  If not, I guess it will be no big effort to revise the scripts, but I think the WoG 3.59 ERM Help should be revised to mention that a button item will not close a DL, after some Era revision number.

(There probably are not a lot of Era 1.8 maps, but I know of two which were affected by this change.  It will not be too much work to revise them, but I can always hope someone will make my work easier, so I ask.)

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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 03:34 PM

Jim, at address $729774 6 bytes should be restored: C70200020000.
Using BinGen or "Tools\BinMagic" one can create a memory patch and place it to Map-Mod\EraPlugins\AfterWoG. This will make all other mods with dialogs incompatible, but after removing the mod everything will be all right again.

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Hobbit
Hobbit


Supreme Hero
subiroK ot għicosutak
posted February 05, 2012 03:48 PM
Edited by Hobbit at 15:55, 05 Feb 2012.

Gosh, I guess you have no idea what we're talking about.

Quote:
Frankly I don't see why this fuzz around WoG. Is just perfect. It allows almost every crazy ideas, and moreover it allows self disabling

Not really. Emissaries, new units, new units' abilities and a lot of other stuff - that actually CAN'T be changed without reverse engineering. And also ERM is buggy and can complicate a lot. Really.

WoG isn't perfect. It isn't bad either, but I (and I guess not only I) just want something different. And therefore ERA for SoD could be a great thing if I don't have much talent to reverse engineering, hex editing and stuff.

Quote:
WoG is a code. This code ensures new data, including enlarged number of monsters and artifacts, some WoG dialogs and features. We can restore campaigns, interface, hide "WoG Options". It seems that this makes you happy, but consider the following problem. Mod X adds new script option to the menu. But you don't have the menu! Mod Y introduces new commander system. But you don't have commanders! Mod Z uses one of default WoG scripts. But you don't have them! Map A uses some of WoG new objects defs. But you disabled them! Em? So how do you think we should release compatible mods, while you don't want to have any scripts, new features, dialogs and buttons. No way!

That's not what I mean. If someone wants to make mod which does need WoG - fine for me. But what if someone wants to make mod which will NOT need WoG, or even it won't be compatible with it? Like, well, HotA, e.g.? Just an add-on? Without that not useful stuff that WoG adds?

Quote:
Hota way is too hard.

Yeah, but they want to add ERA into it, right?

Quote:
Do you like programming and reverse engineering?

No - and that's why I'm asking.

Quote:
Now imagine that a group of modders create a mod with many scripting libraries, new objects and so on. One can write scripts/maps/mods based on their work. But Hobbit and other funs look at it and say: "We wonna default skin, no scripts, no options, no that not professional graphics and we wonna SoD!" Then Valery releases his new map. Hobbit says: "I wonna this map but without installing that big mode.". Em? And so on. Sounds childish and impractical.

Quote:
yeah,sound like hobbit to me too

...do you want to talk about it or insult me just because you love WoG?
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave

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JimV
JimV


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 03:59 PM
Edited by JimV at 23:15, 05 Feb 2012.

Thanks very much!  That will be much easier than changing a dozen DL's.

Edit - that was a reply to Bersy, whose last post was the last post at the time I wrote this, but not after I submitted it.

Mr. Hobbit, I have no wish to offend you but I can play a SoD map under WoG with only these differences:  some of the program opening screens ("skin") will be different, and the Hero Screen will have the "Hands" button for a Commander - but there will be no Commander, no new WoG creatures or objects, no WoG scripts, and the AI sight radius and Arrow Tower behavior will be the same as in SoD.  Oh and there will be no new battlefields.  And no mithril.  All these things can be controlled by the map-maker, or set by the player if the map-maker gives them the options.  So it can be a bit more work for the player or map-maker to enforce SoD rules in a WoG map, but that is in exchange for benefits which some of us enjoy very much.

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Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted February 05, 2012 04:06 PM
Edited by Warmonger at 16:38, 05 Feb 2012.

Quote:

Consider VCMI. First they are to reproduce the whole game in a portable way. Secondly, they add some scripting language. Then they make huge list of API for that language and write documentation and manuals for potential modders. Then (after many days and titan's work) one of modders decides to make changes which cannot be done through existing API. He cannot modify game on hdd or in memory, but only ask to release API or fork the project. Now imagine that a group of modders create a mod with many scripting libraries, new objects and so on. One can write scripts/maps/mods based on their work.

I've just started to put down the structure of modding system which should deal with such issues. Check the link.
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The future of Heroes 3 is here!

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Hobbit
Hobbit


Supreme Hero
subiroK ot għicosutak
posted February 05, 2012 04:20 PM

Quote:
there will be no Commander, no new WoG creatures or objects, no WoG scripts, and the AI sight radius and Arrow Tower behavior will be the same as in WoG.  Oh and there will be no new battlefields.  And no mithril.  All these things can be controlled by the map-maker, or set by the player if the map-maker gives them the options.

But they still would be in game code. And still we would need to use WoG code even if we do not want ANYTHING from WoG. That does not make much sense, does it?

And well, my first question was if it was possible to make something like ERA for SoD. Or wait, no - my first question was if it is possible do modify SoD without WoG while WoG is just an mod for ERA like Bersy said? But then it started to be like "oh my god you're such a child why don't you like WoG all is optional you dumb". What's the point? Huh?
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave

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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 04:27 PM
Edited by Bersy at 16:33, 05 Feb 2012.

Quote:
Yeah, but they want to add ERA into it, right?

No. They want to convert Hota to a mod, compatible with other mods on the same engine. Because in any game with mods support there is no tendency against compatibility.

Quote:
or insult me just

Simply explained and wanted to help. No idea to hurt anyone. I don't get anything for work except reports and requests )

Warmonger, the link is broken.

Quote:
But they still would be in game code. And still we would need to use WoG code even if we do not want ANYTHING from WoG

Which mods do you personally have for SoD? How rich are they? What are they founded on? How is about compatibility? Do they replace SoD common resources like text documents?

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Draker
Draker


Known Hero
Building the Dragon City
posted February 05, 2012 04:31 PM
Edited by Draker at 16:35, 05 Feb 2012.

I have one problem with applying this PAC file.

https://rapidshare.com/files/2578895093/SoD_Icons.pac

It should restore original SoD icons for primary skills and resources. However, placing it in Mods\WoG\Data doesn't have effect. Other two PAC files I have made which contain New objects patch 1.9 + Gnollking HoMM II objects 1.0 and Blood and Diamond Dragons defs from Acid Cave mod are working fine. However, in map editor I still have old defs for Blood and Diamond dragons but in game new ones are displayed.

What am I doing wrong?

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Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted February 05, 2012 04:39 PM

Quote:

Warmonger, the link is broken.



Fixed.
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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 04:41 PM

Draker, create a new folder in mods and subfolder "Data". Example: "Mods\Draker\Data". Place your pac's there.

AKUHAK works:
Restore SoD Interface
Should be places in Mods\Your Mod\EraPlugins\AfterWoG.

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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 04:46 PM

Quote:
In such case file with older modification date has priority.

If file contains a set of resources and only one of them was replaced, the file will have the most recent time. But player wants in general Conversion A to override Conversion B. Otherwise updating different files from conversions will produce something like DLL-hell. Especially if conversions are regularly updated.

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Draker
Draker


Known Hero
Building the Dragon City
posted February 05, 2012 04:59 PM

Quote:
Draker, create a new folder in mods and subfolder "Data". Example: "Mods\Draker\Data". Place your pac's there.

AKUHAK works:
Restore SoD Interface
Should be places in Mods\Your Mod\EraPlugins\AfterWoG.


Creating new folder have done the job but old defs of Blood Dragon and Diamond Dragons are still displayed in map editor. Note that new objects are displayed properly in map editor.

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Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted February 05, 2012 05:12 PM

Quote:
Quote:
In such case file with older modification date has priority.

If file contains a set of resources and only one of them was replaced, the file will have the most recent time. But player wants in general Conversion A to override Conversion B. Otherwise updating different files from conversions will produce something like DLL-hell. Especially if conversions are regularly updated.

Fixed.

Still, this thread becomes messy and now it's about everything but ERA. Plase move to our forum to continue discussion.
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The future of Heroes 3 is here!

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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 05:52 PM

Draker, recheck your pack please, and if it does not work in editor, upload it with only two problematic defs inside.

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Draker
Draker


Known Hero
Building the Dragon City
posted February 05, 2012 06:39 PM

Quote:
Draker, recheck your pack please, and if it does not work in editor, upload it with only two problematic defs inside.


Rechecked. New defs are displayed in game but map editor displays old ones.

https://rapidshare.com/files/1704275074/dragons.pac


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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 07:20 PM

Draker, thanks, eramap.dll bug. Two different loaders.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted February 05, 2012 07:56 PM

Quote:
But then it started to be like "oh my god you're such a child why don't you like WoG all is optional you dumb". What's the point? Huh?


You managed to hijack this thread in no time. I see two options for you and Trith: either start making your own modifications or just give up with such arguments.

You obviously did not install or tested ERA II, because then you would know how to manipulate MODS folder to get rid of emissaries, commanders and everything else. As for their code still being inside, thanks god it is. That's the purpose of modding, offer options. You don't want them, move them out, if I want them, there IS the code which allow me to move them in. Everyone is pleased.
____________
All my Era II mods

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solitaire345
solitaire345


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 05, 2012 07:56 PM

Thanks. The game runs fine, but when I run map editor, I get this error:

Instruction at 0xab3aee referenced memory at 0x00c3c3c0. The memory could not be read. Click Ok to terminate, Cancel to debug.

When I click OK, I get another error:

Instruction at 0x7c80af15 referenced memory at 0x7c80af15. The memory could not be written. Click Ok to terminate, Cancel to debug.

When I click OK, the error message reappears again and again.
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Bersy
Bersy


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted February 05, 2012 08:00 PM

Draker, here is an update.
solitaire315, install on clear SoD or Complete.

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