|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
posted June 07, 2016 10:01 AM |
|
|
They gotta sell somehow.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Kimarous
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 10:22 AM |
|
|
|
After all, the phrase "If at first you don't succeed, try try again" doesn't explicitly state to change your tactics.
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 10:48 AM |
|
|
ChrisD1 said:
And people lets stop being shocked by ubi-politics. It 's getting repetitive
I am about as shocked by their latest gaffe as I am by the tenor of your response mate lol
____________
|
|
alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 12:22 PM |
|
|
Doomforge said:
The map must feel ALIVE for HoMM to be HoMM. It needs dwellings, it needs places to boost your stats, it needs artifacts, and it needs those places where you fights stuff for goodies (such as dragon utopia). You need all of that in reasonable proportions and scaling difficulty, so that it's simply fun to EXPLORE the map. The pure joy of exploration was what captivated me in HoMM2 and HoMM3. It was always "hmm, wonder what's over there!" that kept me going and exploring. (...)
Let's not even start on the magic. HoMM3 had poorly balanced magic, but that was part of its glory. Seeing that glorious icon of town portal in your magic guild... priceless! Let's face it, rare goodies in a RNG-related dice roll aren't good for game balance, but are so much better than a diceroll of pre-defined 2 spells per tier.... @_@ It was addictively fun to build magic guilds and check what kind of spells you got for the game. And if you were stuck with crappy spells, it was fun to explore the possiblities of those spells. It was so fun to experiment with quicksand and forcefield in HoMM3... even if it failed a lot of time.
And the maps! I still remember the amazing HoMM3 maps where you had to slay 300 ancient behemoths by the end of third month, on sacred ground which prevented all magic. Holy... it was just fantastic.
YES!
THANK YOU! This is exactly what I miss about the old games. What you talk about here is the type of gameplay I call "epic adventure gaming". This type of game was not focused on the hero vs. hero matchup. Sure, it was a challenge along the way that you had to overcome on your journey through the map, but it was not the goal in itself. My favorite H3 map was called "The Lord Of War" where you were on this epic journey through all kinds of different lands until in the end, you would reach The Summer Lands. Very early in the game, you'd get a message from The Summer Lands: "Come to the Summer Lands - we have a legion of Arch Angels waiting for you." And they had! And you had to defeat those Castle heroes with their legion of Arch Angels, and it was totally awesome! 
This kind of game was nothing about competition. It was not about balance. But it was the most brilliant fun. It was about abusing all the loopholes in the game. About how you could use force field to defeat a huge army of Black Dragons with a single stack of Titans. About building your hero to level 60 or more with all the most awesome artifacts and spells.
No game after H3 has really succeeded at creating this kind of game. H5 came close, but lack of stability and lack of proper town portal spell prevented it from really happening. This is what I miss about the Heroes series. 
|
|
Articun
Supreme Hero
As i dream, so shall it be!
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 12:46 PM |
|
|
|
But how is this fixed? I mean, does the story of the map matter? The placement of the objects? The visual artistic aspect in general? What gives such an epic feeling to the map and the playthrough?
|
|
EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 12:57 PM |
|
|
|
To me, it is about overcoming tough challenges. And that is why the hero needs the adventure objects the most, which give out resources, armies or relics, some of which may or may not be useful in the current situation. That is also the thrill, never knowing what you can face next. Events, signposts and messages help up build the story.
|
|
Sleeping_Sun
Promising
Famous Hero
Townscreen Architect
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 02:05 PM |
|
|
cleglaw said:
imho you must stop cursing/crushing them at this point. its the real deal, its the expansion. if something gonna save this game, it is this. this is the last chance. if it fails, you can continue forever to bash it i dont care. even i will stop my optimisim if expansion fails... and we only have to wait 2 months for this. am i asking too much? i dont think so.
Well, some people are waiting for a good game since H5:TotE, i.e. since 2007. We are talking about 9 years here... I do not think that people have patience anymore. So, maybe you are asking too much?  Because waiting for Ubisoft and the developer to provide us with a good game seems as if we are all waiting for Godot...
____________
"The age can be wicked to those who walk alone. When I look into the Mirror, I see myself as I might become..." -Freya
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 02:36 PM |
|
Edited by Elvin at 14:36, 07 Jun 2016.
|
no rush
Aany moment now.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 02:39 PM |
|
|
Do you guys realise that you also "help" to make this game worse?
Yes, many constructive ideas have been offered to Limbic and many of them have not been implemented (but some of them have, like random skilling improvement or saturation). So I can understand you are not satissfied. I can also understand this game is not what you expected.
But some people do like the game. And many other people can in the future if some improvements are to come (do not call it "blind faith", I do not say that they will come, I just say they may come).
However, sometimes, I have the feeling you almost want to hate this game. It is an endless discussion but comments like "this game can never be good" really do not help anything, they only harm.
So keep writing these comments, improvements will definitely not come (who would like to spend money on fixing the game nobody likes) and you can say then "we told you the improvements would never come".
____________
Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
|
|
EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 02:59 PM |
|
|
Are you certain in that logic? After all, I did have my patience and a lot of it was ruined, simply because they undervalued customer feedback. Were we responsible for the fact multiplayer was not working, or the fact a lot of bugs still remain in the game?
I do not believe in such things. People had patience and will to believe in this game, which was overturned by spiders, Erwan and Ubilimbic. And one would've hoped that they would've at least learned their lesson from Heroes VI. So whatever blame one is seeking, it is on them. Time for fooling around is over.
____________
Come and visit the Might and Magic Wikia!
|
|
ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 02:59 PM |
|
|
Run, you fool!!!!!
____________
|
|
KoP
Tavern Dweller
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:17 PM |
|
Edited by KoP at 15:23, 07 Jun 2016.
|
alcibiades said:
Doomforge said:
The map must feel ALIVE for HoMM to be HoMM. It needs dwellings, it needs places to boost your stats, it needs artifacts, and it needs those places where you fights stuff for goodies (such as dragon utopia). You need all of that in reasonable proportions and scaling difficulty, so that it's simply fun to EXPLORE the map. The pure joy of exploration was what captivated me in HoMM2 and HoMM3. It was always "hmm, wonder what's over there!" that kept me going and exploring. (...)
YES!
THANK YOU! This is exactly what I miss about the old games. What you talk about here is the type of gameplay I call "epic adventure gaming".
Both Doomforge and Alcibiades have formulated my thoughts on the matter perfectly. Incidentally, it's great to see you two still active around here. I used to be a member almost 10 years ago, but I was a foolish bigoted youngster at the time so I prefer to not disclose my old identity
Unlike many veterans around here, I don't actually hate HoMM VI (yea I refuse to call them Might and Magic Heroes, **** off). In fact, in a lot of aspects, HoMM VI was my favorite, especially when it came to the tactical gameplay that I found very fun. I also appreciated additions like Area of Control (I know it's an unpopular opinion), a big variety of unit passive and active abilities, and the racial abilities that were more developed than in HoMM V. I also preferred its aesthetics to V or even III.
But you are absolutely right in that the 'adventure' side of the game, a pillar to the series, has stumbled downhill and never reached the charm and sense of discovery that HoMM III had. That is in large part because the number of dwellings on the map has shrunk significantly.
But the core of it is what Alcibiades and others touched upon. HoMM was never about competitive multiplayer and that was HoMM VI's sin, and I am saying that as someone who loves the game. Maps were designed with balance and competitive play in mind, most of which were mirror maps whereby you can explore half the map and you might as well have explored all of it. Things like the removal of the Grail didn't help either. Add to that the small number of dwellings, random discoveries, and equipment you can find, and you find yourself in a dull lifeless map.
In HoMM III, I didn't care about battles (after a certain point, I found them boring, actually) and wanted to explore the map. In VI, it was the opposite. I personally prefer the focus to be on both equally.
I haven't played HoMM VII but from what I gather, it still has a lifeless adventure map, which in addition to its other flaws, makes me not that excited for it. That said, I do like the Dwarven roster this time around, seems more interesting than HoMM V.
|
|
Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:19 PM |
|
|
EnergyZ said:
Are you certain in that logic? After all, I did have my patience and a lot of it was ruined, simply because they undervalued customer feedback. Were we responsible for the fact multiplayer was not working, or the fact a lot of bugs still remain in the game?
I do not believe in such things. People had patience and will to believe in this game, which was overturned by spiders, Erwan and Ubilimbic. And one would've hoped that they would've at least learned their lesson from Heroes VI. So whatever blame one is seeking, it is on them. Time for fooling around is over.
I do not say anything like fans are responsible for the problems or failures. I know about many problems too. Also you do not have to believe that H7 may become good.
Nevertheless it can at certainly become better than it is now...
But prefer to keep complaining and reprobating this game? Then the improvements probably won't come (explained above).
These things have sense as soon as the development ends and you know that NO changes won't come, that the game won't become better.
Then I will support these critics but not sooner. Hopefully you understand my logic a bit now (it does not mean you have to agree  )
____________
Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
|
|
JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:26 PM |
|
|
Look, the problem is, that with the design choices that were made, it was clear the game would not be considered great by a majority - except for Ubilimb, which is what sucks, and which is what some people don't seem to understamd: how can you trust people to make a good game when they seem to have wrong ideas about what is good and what not?
And keep in mind that for this game there is no "average": the game is either great or a failure, with 6 games before it (something else they didn't seem to get).
|
|
Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:30 PM |
|
|
Antalyan, the camel's back was broken long before it had to carry H7. H7 was the last straw for a high amount of people - A far higher amount than ubi could afford to piss off/disappoint.
____________
H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
|
|
Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:45 PM |
|
|
I don't want to convince you about how great this game is.
I understand people's frustration as I was personally many times dsappointed.
But I want as many improvements for H7 as possible. Why should not I want the product I own to become better?
____________
Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
|
|
Antalyan
Promising
Supreme Hero
H7 Forever
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:47 PM |
|
|
2.0 patch will include In game RMG, change to sim turns, Skill wheel change, new neutrals, new skirmish and scenario maps, balance changes, the largest amount of bug fixes, AI calculation tweaks and a myriad of other things. That's what you get if you just DL the patch for the vanilla game.
____________
Important H7 tips & tricks
H7 Community Patch (UCP)
|
|
Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:50 PM |
|
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:51 PM |
|
|
have you ever heard of a phrase from old mythology called the dolorous stroke lol
the dolorous stroke is from the story of the Grail and basically amounts to a curse, a wound delivered to the loins of the king, which goes on to drive his entire kingdom infertile and corrupt, the lands become a wasteland, monsters arrive and ransack the land, the peasants are all screwed for years, something is rotten in the state of Denmark" as they say, and nothing can be done about it until that wound is healed and the curse goes away lol
no matter whether the random patsies in the field give the king constructive feedback, or report bugs to the king, or kick each other up the arse, none of it is going to solve the underlying problem and it's not going to impact anything in the long run, so instead they do what all rational people do, they settle down, enjoy the ride and complain,
they party on and spread word that a white knight of the round table must come in and heal the king and the dolorous stroke, or else they might as well party on until they die, because else they'll die anyway at the hands of the wasteland and the monsters lol
the specific garbage the king is getting up to in the meantime really doesn't matter, it's a total sideshow to the point,
a couple of patsies may be able to tend the wound and subtly improve what happens a bit, maybe one more piece of fruit will grow or maybe one less monster will arrive,
but at the same time they're not doing anything to spread the word that there's a problem we need a white knight to solve, and at the end of the day if the wound is still there and everyone's still going to get killed, their efforts to help are nothing but a load of bollocks lol
____________
|
|
verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
|
|
posted June 07, 2016 03:52 PM |
|
|
this heavy handed analogy has been brought to you by Erwin And Sons LLC lol
____________
|
| |
|
|
This MEGA THREAD is pages long: 
