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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 14, 2014 11:06 AM |
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Stevie said:
I don't understand why Moon Doe/Sun Deer would be WoW. I didn't see Nelfs or Belfs riding deer or anything like that. They're either neutrals or critters. But if that's accepted as an argument, then wolves, bears and all other animals are all WoW. I don't think I can accept that argument.
And I find it quite ridiculous to fight over deer when they're real life animals. I don't really understand, did Blizzard acquire the intellectual rights for deer?
It's not that. Any creature could be well implemented into a Heroes game. If the game itself is not drowned into this generic artistic trend that is, to make shortcuts, associated with WoW.
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 14, 2014 11:07 AM |
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Edited by Avonu at 11:07, 14 Sep 2014.
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ChrisD1 said:
then why pick earth's balance for offense when you have sylanna's fury? you can utilise the green dragon there. AND you will have the option to give a taste of defense with treants if you ever want to do that.
Because you have both Treant and Green Dragon in ALL line-ups. And both Treant and Dragon seem to have similar roles in combat - walking tanks. Phoenix seems to be: a) a flyer, b) focused on damage, c) speed unit
Also I want Emerald Knight and Snake in Sylvan forces. And I don't like Inferno type army: great DD dealers but dieing like flies - and this seems to be Fury's feature (excluding champions).
I would prefer Deer/Unicorn too, but they are lower on my prioryty list. I would also like to have one line-up with Treant/Phoenix but there is no such option.
____________
"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 14, 2014 11:09 AM |
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Avonu said:
I would also like to have one line-up with Treant/Phoenix but there is no such option.
Neither as Phoenix/Unicorn option 
I think Ubisoft's politics regarding the franchise has turned into a joke : they even create separatist clans among the fans. Truth is that they just can't handle the franchise properly.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:10 AM |
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Good start to read about snakes:
Snake symbolism
There is nothing there that would qualify snakes for being "evil".
Also, I don't like to play with units that are part of a normal cuisine: chicken, turkey, cow, pig, goose, duck, deer ...
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 14, 2014 11:11 AM |
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JollyJoker said:
Also, I don't like to play with units that are part of a normal cuisine: chicken, turkey, cow, pig, goose, duck, deer ...
Well "normal" cuisine depends on culture.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:17 AM |
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Could someone please tell JJ that the fact that organic beings are edible does not mean that they are irrelevant for fantasy?
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:26 AM |
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Avonu said:
ChrisD1 said:
then why pick earth's balance for offense when you have sylanna's fury? you can utilise the green dragon there. AND you will have the option to give a taste of defense with treants if you ever want to do that.
Because you have both Treant and Green Dragon in ALL line-ups. And both Treant and Dragon seem to have similar roles in combat - walking tanks. Phoenix seems to be: a) a flyer, b) focused on damage, c) speed unit
Also I want Emerald Knight and Snake in Sylvan forces. And I don't like Inferno type army: great DD dealers but dieing like flies - and this seems to be Fury's feature (excluding champions).
I would prefer Deer/Unicorn too, but they are lower on my prioryty list. I would also like to have one line-up with Treant/Phoenix but there is no such option.
as you said they SEEM to have similar roles. we don't know yet and they won't make them the same. Also they won't make the treant the same whether he is a champion or an elite.
No one said they are both tanks and for the billionth time walker does not mean tank (rakshasa, fury from dungeon and so much more.)
and yes i read the descriptions but of course it's not final.
well you contradict yourself, because you don't want glass cannons but that's exactly what the phoenix will be.
No way a unit that reborns will have high defense, it will be devastating in terms of balance.
As for the rest they are preferences and everyone is entitled to them
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 14, 2014 11:36 AM |
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Edited by Avonu at 11:50, 14 Sep 2014.
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ChrisD1 said:
well you contradict yourself, because you don't want glass cannons but that's exactly what the phoenix will be.
No way a unit that reborns will have high defense, it will be devastating in terms of balance.
I wrote about army, not one unit.
There is a HUGE difference between having glass cannons in core and elites and having ONE champion as glass cannon and second champion in role of tank/dd.
If I would to have tank, I would choose Dragon, if I would like DD, I would choose Phoenix. Meanwhile my cores and elites could survive without them.
Now with fury you can choose between tank and tank/dd. Meanwhile your cores would die like flies, elites probaly also would have some problems to be keep alive. When you recruit champions, you would have units that can soak damage, but that would be late game by now.
EDIT:
20 posts per day, really? 
____________
"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:40 AM |
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Edited by Stevie at 11:41, 14 Sep 2014.
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Except Phoenix's role is not Damage Dealer. It's an Utility-Tank with self rez.
Phoenix/Greater Phoenix: flying and hard-to-kill creature with self-resurrection ability and supporting abilities
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:45 AM |
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Avonu said:
ChrisD1 said:
well you contradict yourself, because you don't want glass cannons but that's exactly what the phoenix will be.
No way a unit that reborns will have high defense, it will be devastating in terms of balance.
I wrote about army, not one unit.
There is a HUGE difference between having glass cannons in core and elites and having ONE champion as glass cannon and second champion in role of tank/dd.
If I would to have tank, I would choose Dragon, if I would like DD, I would choose Phoenix. Meanwhile my cores and elites could survive without them.
Now with fury you can choose between tank and tank/dd. Meanwhile your cores would die like flies, elites probaly also would have some problems to be keep alive. When you recruit champions, you would have units that can soak damage, but that would be late game by now.
we did mention the phoenix though
would you rather buy again a champion unit or a core unit when it's dead? also what is DD? and don't forget balance. low defence units will compensate for high initiative and attack which can be a good thing in the early game. (yup i know the risk of low defence but still in more cases attack and speed will get you through).
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 11:49 AM |
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Edited by ChrisD1 at 11:55, 14 Sep 2014.
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Stevie said:
Except Phoenix's role is not Damage Dealer. It's an Utility-Tank with self rez.
Phoenix/Greater Phoenix: flying and hard-to-kill creature with self-resurrection ability and supporting abilities
hard to kill does not mean great defence. it might apply damage when it's attacked. yet its defence will still be low.
and if phoenix is a tank and reborns and does high damage, then it's the worst thing ever as it negates balance completely.
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TDL
Honorable
Supreme Hero
The weak suffer. I endure.
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posted September 14, 2014 12:02 PM |
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While H4 is a bad example for you people in any case, tank+high damage worked well for H4 phoenixes and bone dragons. In theory they seemed like unstoppable creatures but they were let down in other aspects, ie speed, attack, etc.
____________
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 12:06 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 12:07, 14 Sep 2014.
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hard to kill  resilient
self rez utility
support abilities support
I don't see anything offensive about those. Yet I see a lot of defensive ones. Even if it has Fire Shield, it's still defensive, because it implies being hit to take effect.
Even the Line-up as far as champion goes suggests that. The Dragon is the Damage Dealer while the Treant and the Phoenix are the Utility-Tanks.
So assuming that Balance has more offensive potential than Fury because of Phoenixes is not just far fetched, but it comes in direct contradiction with the unit's description.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 12:16 PM |
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Stevie said:
Could someone please tell JJ that the fact that organic beings are edible does not mean that they are irrelevant for fantasy?
Which part of "I don't like to play with my food?" don't you understand? It's fine, when you do - I don't.
And, come on, a DOE? Why don't you send little rabbits, mayne they get a cuddly bonus or something.
Even more so when you'd expect that creature to be part of the Stag Duchy - that incidentally seems to be involved as well, not that I'd have more fun playing them for Haven.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 14, 2014 12:31 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
And, come on, a DOE? Why don't you send little rabbits, mayne they get a cuddly bonus or something.
This is precisely why some artwork would be greatly appreciated. I believe Doe could be a magical creature that would fit Sylvan beautifully and adds fresh air to the faction if will designed. Very, well designed.
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cleglaw
Famous Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 12:39 PM |
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i hate to see developers trying to follow WoW.
first they painted orcs and made them slave background.
(i still want my old green orcs.)
now they want to bring moon animals, moon deers to connect with elves just like in WoW.
HoMM has its own universe i m sick of this copy/paste style.
i voted balance but i can still understand choice of strenght, but i cant understandt the fury choice.
fury has lots of cons:
-WoW copy.
-Too many humanoids(and one of them is "blade dancer" which was a shemale in H5)
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 12:40 PM |
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Galaad said:
This is precisely why some artwork would be greatly appreciated. I believe Doe could be a magical creature that would fit Sylvan beautifully and adds fresh air to the faction if will designed. Very, well designed.
+1
deers are very iconic creatures complementin sylvan extremely well. and that's why it's them or the unicorns.
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Kronos1000
Promising
Supreme Hero
Fryslân Boppe
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posted September 14, 2014 12:45 PM |
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32%-36%-32% It seems Fury is completely back in the race now.
No matter which line-up you support, I think we can all agree that we desperately need more information.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 14, 2014 12:48 PM |
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Edited by Galaad at 12:50, 14 Sep 2014.
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cleglaw said:
i hate to see developers trying to follow WoW.
now they want to bring moon animals, moon deers to connect with elves just like in WoW.
Yes, but it doesn't mean Doe would be a bad unit for Sylvan.
Kronos1000 said:
32%-36%-32% It seems Fury is completely back in the race now.
No matter which line-up you support, I think we can all agree that we desperately need more information.
That for sure, I'm changing my mind everyday it's ridiculous.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 14, 2014 12:48 PM |
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Edited by ChrisD1 at 12:50, 14 Sep 2014.
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cleglaw said:
fury has lots of cons:
-WoW copy.
-Too many humanoids(and one of them is "blade dancer" which was a shemale in H5)
I've never played WoW, but deers and moon does are a thing in most mythologies. watch princess mononoke for that. WoW was never something original that other games copied so your first con in invalid.
as for your second con, each line up has 3 humanoids. druid, archer and then it's blade dancer/emerald knight.
Fury is best suited for sylvan as they have described sylvan with their "guerilla tactics".
Lots of the creatures are so iconic to sylvan and it will give us the most atmospheric interpretetion of sylvan.
No snakes, no phoenixes! if that ain't a pro, I don't know what it is.
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This thread is pages long: 
