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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted March 27, 2022 02:27 PM |
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I'm better than purerogue. Let's show you!
Pity! Ihor and Ben80 are here, I choose rape for roleplay with Ukrainian woman. 
We are legendary mad..
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 02:40 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 14:48, 27 Mar 2022.
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Only mad people agree to rule countries  Putting aside jokes, I don't see many scientists and professors amongst presidents.
I propose Elon Musk for president. He's mad, rich, and love science.
1. Mad. People will like him, as they used to like mad rulers.
2. Rich. He won't be stealing money from poor citizens.
3. Science. We well be developing x10 times faster.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted March 27, 2022 03:07 PM |
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ihor said:
And all the women, who are rape victims share the responsibility because they wore mini-skirts, right?
Letting aside the sarcasm, it's a very pertinent comparison. There are about 2 billion people on earth who will, if not speak loudly, at least think there is more or less of a responsibility, because their religion says so. Add to that a few billions of Africans without access to education, which will also take it as an open invitation, right?
The point is: no matter what is discussed, morals, ethics, there are always parts of the world and groups of individuals where your "evidence" isn't so. And that's the dead end, everyone made the mistake considering Russia as aiming to occidental type of thinking: fanatically globalist, pro-immigration, pacifist and so.
And it is not. Pushing ideology will not work, so what's left as options, open War or Negotiate while taking very seriously into account their conditions. The first option is technically impossible, so...
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 03:20 PM |
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Also here is my personal hero - Ron Paul
I'm sure this world would be better with him as president.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 03:25 PM |
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Salamandre said:
That's binary thinking. Responsibilities are multiple, hence the solution for peace can't come only from Russia.
Completely beside the point. There are only two parties in this war, Russia and the Ukraine. The Ukraine can end the war only by surrendering. Russia can end the war whichever way they want, from complete destruction to simply stop fighting and retreat.
All other parties are only in supporting roles, but cannot decide anything.
The trouble at this point is, that Russia can't "win" the war in any meaningful way (and is destroying itself economically and so on), the way it looks like, but before they back down and concede the'll probably rather destroy the country completely and hand themselves over to China.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted March 27, 2022 03:33 PM |
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From my understanding, negotiations are ongoing right now.
I see those points on the table:
The Kremlin said on Friday the conflict in Ukraine would end when the West took action over Russia's repeatedly raised concerns about the killing of civilians in eastern Ukraine and NATO enlargement eastwards.
and
Putin says the "special military operation" in Ukraine is essential to ensure Russian security after the United States enlarged the membership of NATO up to Russia's borders and supported pro-Western leaders in Kyiv.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 03:47 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 15:52, 27 Mar 2022.
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Mind that Russia also wants both newfound republics to join it via referendum. I doubt that Ukraine will allow this to happen. And do you think that all will be over after the war? This pandora box has plenty of room for dozens of future conflicts.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 04:08 PM |
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Salamandre said:
From my understanding, negotiations are ongoing right now.
I see those points on the table:
The Kremlin said on Friday the conflict in Ukraine would end when the West took action over Russia's repeatedly raised concerns about the killing of civilians in eastern Ukraine and NATO enlargement eastwards.
and
Putin says the "special military operation" in Ukraine is essential to ensure Russian security after the United States enlarged the membership of NATO up to Russia's borders and supported pro-Western leaders in Kyiv.
But that is nonsense. NATO is a DEFENSE alliance. There has only been ONE case when the casus foederis has been called, and that's in reaction to 9/11. Turkey wanted NATO support in the Syria war in 2020 when Turkish soldiers were killed by the Assad side (supported by Russia), howeverm casus foederis doesn't apply in case of a counterattack (syria) after an original attack of a NATO partner.
So as an example, if Poland would attack Russia in support of the Ukraine and then Russia would counterattack into Poland, this would NOT constitute a case for NATO to support Poland.
As I said earlier, if Russia doesn't want their neighbours to look for allies they should stop attacking them.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 04:21 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 16:21, 27 Mar 2022.
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Quote:
So as an example, if Poland would attack Russia in support of the Ukraine and then Russia would counterattack into Poland, this would NOT constitute a case for NATO to support Poland.
I doubt it's possible. And Russia understands that. No one European country is capable to wage war against Russia alone. It's suicide. And even together they need excellent coordination between them. Some countries definitely would want to stay as neutral as possible. The EU is not one country unlike Russia. My "inner war diletant" tells me that there are two armies in the whole world which can speak to Russia as equals. And one of them sympathizes with Russia. So there is only one power left.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 04:45 PM |
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The most difficult part for both sides which is preventing peace is the thought of that all this mayhem was in vain. The best scenario for Ukraine is to restore its borders to pre-2014 state. The best scenario for Russia is Yanukovich in Kyiv. You should understand that both of them are inacceptable scenarios. And the second one is not just empty words, alas. And mind that this war machine has great inertion, so it must be stopped as soon as possible.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted March 27, 2022 05:08 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
But that is nonsense.
No, it is not.
The Monroe Doctrine
The Monroe Doctrine is the best known U.S. policy toward the Western Hemisphere. Buried in a routine annual message delivered to Congress by President James Monroe in December 1823, the doctrine warns European nations that the United States would not tolerate further colonization or puppet monarchs. The doctrine was conceived to meet major concerns of the moment, but it soon became a watchword of U.S. policy in the Western Hemisphere.
and
In 1962, the Monroe Doctrine was invoked symbolically when the Soviet Union began to build missile-launching sites in Cuba. With the support of the Organization of American States, President John F. Kennedy threw a naval and air quarantine around the island. After several tense days, the Soviet Union agreed to withdraw the missiles and dismantle the sites. Subsequently, the United States dismantled several of its obsolete air and missile bases in Turkey.
There is no reason into barking at Putin how he should not react when nuclear missiles are placed in borderline countries when we already had that situation by the past and it worked exactly the same way.
____________
Era II mods and utilities
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 05:11 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 17:15, 27 Mar 2022.
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A crazy idea, but I will repeat -
1. Negotiations in Beijing (I was surprised that I'm not the only one who thinks so, by the way). Putin vs Zelensky, tet-a-tet.
2. A compromiss regarding disputed territories.
3. Guarantees of peace to Ukraine by two polar forces - The US and China. Sounds crazy, but I think it would work. If not the US and China, then who else?
4. In addition, it's nice idea about U-24, but I don't know if it's crazier than what I propose.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 05:43 PM |
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Salamandre said:
JollyJoker said:
But that is nonsense.
No, it is not.
The Monroe Doctrine
The Monroe Doctrine is the best known U.S. policy toward the Western Hemisphere. Buried in a routine annual message delivered to Congress by President James Monroe in December 1823, the doctrine warns European nations that the United States would not tolerate further colonization or puppet monarchs. The doctrine was conceived to meet major concerns of the moment, but it soon became a watchword of U.S. policy in the Western Hemisphere.
and
In 1962, the Monroe Doctrine was invoked symbolically when the Soviet Union began to build missile-launching sites in Cuba. With the support of the Organization of American States, President John F. Kennedy threw a naval and air quarantine around the island. After several tense days, the Soviet Union agreed to withdraw the missiles and dismantle the sites. Subsequently, the United States dismantled several of its obsolete air and missile bases in Turkey.
There is no reason into barking at Putin how he should not react when nuclear missiles are placed in borderline countries when we already had that situation by the past and it worked exactly the same way.
Yes, it is nonsense. Because there have been no nuclear weapons in Eastern Europe. Goes back to the Gorbachev-Bush agreement. Which is NOW null and void due to the attack on the Ukraine.
It's complete nonsense anyway, because, seriously, there is no attack possible on Russia without risking total nuclear destruction (and vice versa); that's what kept everyone at bay. Whether Poland belongs to NATO or not - irrelevant. Except that Russia can't do anything AGAINST Poland. If Ukraine WAS in the NATO, well. And that's why Georgia wants in (Russia controls 20% of Georgia).
So Cuba is a case that hasn't happened in Europe. And the US didn't declare war on Cuba and assaulted them either.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 05:52 PM |
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Edited by AlexSpl at 18:07, 27 Mar 2022.
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AlexSpl
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 06:39 PM |
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted March 27, 2022 11:11 PM |
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purerogue
Known Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 11:16 PM |
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Ghost said:
I'm better than purerogue. Let's show you!
Pity! Ihor and Ben80 are here, I choose rape for roleplay with Ukrainian woman.
We are legendary mad..
Henceforth, you shall be known as The Rapist of Kiev
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 11:20 PM |
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Salamandre said:
John Mearsheimer : Ukraine Invasion
Is on french television, but in english.
You mean the Mearsheimer who said in 2015 (drum roll):
Quote:
if you really want to wreck Russia, what you should do is to encourage it to try to conquer Ukraine. Putin is much too smart to try that
(Try this)
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purerogue
Known Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 11:37 PM |
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AlexSpl said:
I propose Elon Musk for president. He's mad, rich, and love science.
1. Mad. People will like him, as they used to like mad rulers.
2. Rich. He won't be stealing money from poor citizens.
3. Science. We well be developing x10 times faster.
just mad he can't become president
The only current politician I like is Bernie Sanders, not because anything he proposes will work or should even be imposed, but because he is honest.
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purerogue
Known Hero
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posted March 27, 2022 11:52 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
You mean the Mearsheimer who said in 2015 (drum roll):
Quote:
if you really want to wreck Russia, what you should do is to encourage it to try to conquer Ukraine. Putin is much too smart to try that
(Try this)
Haha, he's assuming Putin is rational.
He's getting old, mught have had/having a brush with mortality, living in an echo chamber, blind to the dilapidation of the army, not have a good grasp of the ultimate ability/will of his subordinates to carry out task at 'the edge', which is to say they'll work for him but don't want to die for him.
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This thread is pages long: 
