Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile

<a href='http://www.game-advertising-online.com/' target='_blank'>Game Advertising Online</a><br> banner requires iframes

Age of Heroes Headlines:  
20 Dec 2014: A Christmas Gift: Random Skills in Heroes VII! - read more
16 Dec 2014: Introducing Shapers of Lore, Academy Line-Up Detailed - read more
10 Dec 2014: Heroes III HD Remake Announced for January 29th! - read more
5 Dec 2014: Website Update delayed, Community Q&A, new Vote on the way! - read more
24 Nov 2014: The Wizardsí Armies Have Arrived! - read more
14 Nov 2014: Dungeon Line-up Vote #2 Results! - read more
11 Nov 2014: HC Icon Contest, Sylvan Townscreen Vote #2 - read more
7 Nov 2014: Dungeon Line-up Vote Round 2, Sylvan Townscreen Part 1! - read more
2 Nov 2014: Dungeon wins, line-up vote starts! - read more
18 Oct 2014: Tidbits of Information from Twitch.tv Stream! - read more
20 Dec 2014: A Christmas Gift: Random Skills in Heroes VII! - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info forum | HOMM4: info forum | HOMM5: info forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Secrets of destruction revealed - playing Dungeon faction
Thread: Secrets of destruction revealed - playing Dungeon faction [ This thread is 61 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 (44) 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 ]
nosfe
nosfe


Adventuring Hero
posted March 12, 2008 10:33 AM

thats what i do, but sometimes it just doesn't want to work, in a game i was level 8 before i got offered destructive, and i just kept selecting skills from enlightenment/irresistable, i was even offered leadership twice

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
ChaosDragon
ChaosDragon


Famous Hero
posted March 12, 2008 10:36 AM

Yup, that's the art of magic oriented faction.

You need to steer your skills.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
samiekl
samiekl


Supreme Hero
posted March 12, 2008 10:37 AM
Edited by samiekl at 10:38, 12 Mar 2008.

In a game with Sorgal it happened to me too, but i had destructive until all perks from irresistible and attack were taken. And there i used mass haste a lot and army to kill creeps. You need to make full use of what you have. Dungeon has something most other towns dont have. Theres no skill thats useless, so, as a guy here already mentioned, you just need to be creative.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Sargeras
Sargeras


Known Hero
the Fallen
posted March 12, 2008 10:51 AM
Edited by Sargeras at 10:53, 12 Mar 2008.

...sorry, don't want to be rude but IMO it's unbeliveable. U can't tell me "I always get a 2% perk if i want it, you just have to know how to wait for it"...example: in ten games i didn't get leadership even once, defense: 2 times, light: 2 times so it can't be that i'm so unlucky (or maybe it can )that u can get it always and i can't.
U're right about might warlock and sorcery and i understand about might in artifacts; but one more thing: what's the point then in percentage for obtaining skills if u can always have the skills u want to ?
____________
Now they shall be consumed by the very flame they sought to control...

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
samiekl
samiekl


Supreme Hero
posted March 12, 2008 10:56 AM

well, you dont have to believe me if its unbelievable. Might in artifacts i mean buy artifatcs that enhance attack and defense, but mostly attack. so, instead of having 30-40 spellpower, have 30-40 attack with morale, luck, etc

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
ChaosDragon
ChaosDragon


Famous Hero
posted March 12, 2008 12:22 PM

Quote:
...sorry, don't want to be rude but IMO it's unbeliveable. U can't tell me "I always get a 2% perk if i want it, you just have to know how to wait for it"...example: in ten games i didn't get leadership even once, defense: 2 times, light: 2 times so it can't be that i'm so unlucky (or maybe it can )that u can get it always and i can't.
U're right about might warlock and sorcery and i understand about might in artifacts; but one more thing: what's the point then in percentage for obtaining skills if u can always have the skills u want to ?



IMO, what you'll get is randomized in the begining of your game.

Sure, you can steer it, i mean you can control and predict what you'll get, but some long perks (i.e: ultimate skill for every faction, divine guidance for warlock, etc) are too unpredictable.

Sometimes, you will never get a short perk like fiery wrath or ignite, sometimes, even perks shorter than those will never offered to you.

So, just use what is available to you.

Example, if you get defence for warlock, i'd say it's nice, at least its power of endurance help you in some situations.

Another example, this may sound crazy, first, you're offered attack, then leadership, try to get retribution and power of speed. Divine guidance, power of speed and retribution are nice if you go with might warlock and you think that you're unlucky (because you're offered leadership and attack).




 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
titoget
titoget

Tavern Dweller
posted March 17, 2008 05:15 PM

Hello there. I have a question, where can i find a list of the skills and perks and what are my chanses of getting them in percentage? thanx

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2008 05:58 PM

the skillwheel at www.celestialheavens.com?

you also have it somewhere with the game (or at least with the french version) documents made by the community.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Elvin Online
Elvin

Hero of Order
Stillness within Movement
posted March 17, 2008 07:01 PM

If you have TotE then go to C:\Program Files\Ubisoft\Heroes of Might and Magic V - Tribes of the East\FanDocuments. You will find the skillwheel and the fan manual there.
____________
So the next time your cat leaves a bleeding, twitching corpse on your doormat, remember that she loves you and is just trying to bring out your inner predator.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Drunk_Lord
Drunk_Lord


Known Hero
very happy hero :)
posted March 18, 2008 07:32 AM

In theory a 2% chance skill will occur rarely. But in reality it depends on luck. Example with spectres in HoF: they got 50% chance of incorporeality, but it happened to me to miss them 5 times
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Anakrom
Anakrom


Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
posted March 18, 2008 09:17 AM

Quote:
it happened to me to miss them 5 times

But not in the row
____________
Result matters

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Drunk_Lord
Drunk_Lord


Known Hero
very happy hero :)
posted March 18, 2008 09:22 AM

Quote:
Quote:
it happened to me to miss them 5 times

But not in the row

In fact I missed them in row
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Sargeras
Sargeras


Known Hero
the Fallen
posted March 18, 2008 09:29 AM

...luck dude heh...
____________
Now they shall be consumed by the very flame they sought to control...

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Anakrom
Anakrom


Known Hero
(Scroll) Out of the blue
posted March 18, 2008 09:34 AM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
it happened to me to miss them 5 times

But not in the row

In fact I missed them in row

Incorporeal - There can be at most 3 hits/misses in a row on all Incorporeal stacks, after which the fourth try will be forced to miss (after 3 hits) or hit (after 3 misses). This counter is global (for all stacks), not tied to each stack.
Than you had Ghosts/Spectres and handled it pretty bad.

Sry for going offtopic.
____________
Result matters

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
ChaosDragon
ChaosDragon


Famous Hero
posted March 18, 2008 11:40 AM

Yup, it's indeed 2% chance, but don't believe it to be exactly like that, because the most important thing is your luck (i mean the player luck, not luck of your heroes in the game)

I remember something about fabrice and the developer said that a player luck is a big factor in the game.

Also, they plan to use a system like this, example: if you win a battle againts enemy hero, there is a chance that a dragon will come and sweep all your army and you lose. However, that thing was only a plan. (But my point is, in any heroes games, player luck is always an important thing)


 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
feluniozbunio
feluniozbunio


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted March 18, 2008 11:42 AM

Just stopped. Nice to see my thread grew up that big
Maybe ill play one day but for the moment im busy cleaning people out of their money playing poker, and doing it pretty well Anyways, thnx for  keeping the topic alive peope

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
feluniozbunio
feluniozbunio


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted March 18, 2008 11:43 AM

Um what a heck happened to edit button? Lol i always edited posts to correct mistakes , omg this is horrible

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Drunk_Lord
Drunk_Lord


Known Hero
very happy hero :)
posted March 18, 2008 11:55 AM
Edited by Drunk_Lord at 12:26, 18 Mar 2008.

welcome back about the edit button, if u wrote the post logged as UserName and now log as username the edit button won't show. If u want to edit that post u must log as UserName
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Nameless
Nameless

Tavern Dweller
posted March 26, 2008 12:28 AM bonus applied by alcibiades on 26 Mar 2008.
Edited by nameless at 01:50, 26 Mar 2008.

Dungeon, Pt 1

k... I see that many greats and just about everybody else have posted their walkthroughs... here's my 2 cents.

I will have to do this in portions, as there's a midterm Thursday that I have to study for, but I am so stressed by now that some analysis of my favorite game will probably do me good.

Today I present for your critique the opening strategy and creatures.

Opening strategy

We're talking Hard of course. As in Die Hard. Yippie-ki-yay, %&$*#^%*@#!

I always take Yrwanna. Honestly, there was a time when I preferred Sinitar, and I'd always wind up with less mana and SP than I would with Yrwanna. On large maps. So forget it. Besides, she usually gets offered empowered spells almost immediately.

I only stay in the town (or within one turn of it) for as long as it takes to build the following (depends on the map of course, and how many of these you already have):

- Tavern (buy both heroes offered)
- School of the Unseen Hand
- School of the Black Heart (upgrade scouts to stalkers (duh!)... we take wood and ore without losses now, unless it's the sprites... in the latter case, I give Yrwanna the alien hero's army)
- Magic Guild (this is where I bring Yrwanna home after she's picked up the immediately surrounding chests, she will usually have gained at least 1 knowledge, sometimes more, so with any luck you will have 30-40 mana)
- Blood Arena (this is when Yrwanna leaves all furies at home with one of the garbage heroes staying in town, and heads out)

NOW, usually the map creators are not so cruel as not to provide you with at least the tavern and school of the unseen hand... so ideally this is day 4, because I will have used an extra turn to build Magic Guild level 2... once we go creeping we do not want to have to go back until we can't get through somewhere without a shower or a chain lightning (CL from here on out), MG2 will give us one of the bolts of course...

- Blood Memorial (the garbage hero whom we left in town upgrades all furies and chases Yrwanna giving them to her. The garbage hero then stays there, within a day's walk of the town, ideally parked at a nearby mill.)

WE'll talk about the creeping strategies tomorrow. Ideally it is now day 5, Yrwanna has all of her movement points (and //empowered// spells of levels 1 and 2), you have 6 stacks of stalkers, 5 of 1 each, the sixth stack of ~20 (~30 if you're lucky enough to have landed Vayshan in the tavern), and a stack of 17 furies (14 if you landed Vayshan, but the stalkers will prove to be worth it). If you haven't wasted the alien hero's army on sprites, the alien hero will now accompany Yrwanna as she creeps the mines, saving her the movement points. To be continued.





Creatures

1. SCOUT-ASSASSIN-STALKER

Scouts are pretty useless, IMO. I don't play original H5 anymore, so we'll just skip straight to ToE. This is where possibly the greatest upgrade in all of H5 may be found. Stalkers!!! mmm... where to begin?

The following are just a few of my favorite things (hope you forgive me if I keep a few to myself )

- Stalkers help you get through shooters in week 1 and week 2 where before you would have lost furies. Now as you creep, when you come across shooters you take the furies out and attack with 6 stacks of stalkers. The danger always is that the stupid ATB will kick in, and you will lose that one power stack that is there to win you the battle. I mean, unless you intend to use the spells only, but seeing as how at least 50% of all neutrals are shooters (or casters) you probably don't want to perform dark ritual (DR from here on out) every other day, and mana wells may not be readily accessible. The truth is, it's really worth the risk to keep the power stack in. If you keep the furies instead, they will always get decimated, and that'll hurt more in the long run. Now, since you have 6 stacks of stalker and only one of them is ~20, there's really only a 17% chance it is the power stack that will yield to the neutral.

Okay, we are invisible, now what? If the neutral is weak (level 1-2 shooters/casters all qualify, then it becomes dicey), in weeks 1 and 2 don't waste mana (you probably don't have enough to continuously blast everybody off the map without having to recharge frequently), but rather stride across that field boldly, skip the first two turns that way, use the hero to shoot at one of the enemy stacks, then cover all but one stack (if there are more than one) with your stacks of 1's, finally attack the upper or bottom (or upgraded) stack of the shooter with your power stack while still invisible. If the shooter is large (centaurs), make sure you block the way to your power stack with the 1's. It is also a good idea to surround multiple shooter stacks with at least 2 stalkers each. Ideally no one will get to shoot and you will lose 2-3 stalkers tops, oftentimes 1-2. This is for weeks 1-2 only, by week 3 you should have enough mana and SP to blast things.

- When you're playing a human opponent, chances are they will want to impose a time limit. This is where your stalkers kick in. As you creep, especially in weeks 2 and 3, as Yrwanna's mana rockets up to 60-100, everybody else will have to (especially if it's the 2 minute drill) save the battles vs neutrals for the end of their turn. As a result they will normally (note: not necessarily) creep one neutral per turn. You on the other hand, particularly if it's a non-shooter, will be spared that obstacle. First you spend up to 6 seconds taking the groups of 1 stalker and the furies out (this takes a little practice, always hitting the open slot), then you make that remaining stack invisible. The whole thing should take 40-30 seconds... especially since against one stack the opposing neutral is likely to likewise counter with only one of his own... now you go: "c", select invisibility, click, "c", select spell, aim, click, space, "c", select spell, aim, click... with a little practice you'll be clocking in at 30 seconds, if it's multiple stacks of neutrals, a minute tops. But be sure before you attack that you have enough mana and SP, or else...

2. BLOOD MAIDEN-FURY-SISTER

Really hott stuff. Maidens are useless though, you really want to wait those few days to get the furies since it'll send you on an endless creeping conquest where the limits are dictated by your skill alone. Sisters have 14 initiative to furies' 16, can't rely on them. But always take furies out when creeping the shooters and casters. More on this tomorrow, when I will deal with the challenges of the early creeping.

3. MINOTAURS

To tell you the truth, I only build them on large maps. I don't really think about the upgrade until that endgame battle, and even then not unless everything else is exactly the way I want it. If it's a large map I do not hesitate building them, however.

4. DARK RAIDERS-GRIM RAIDERS-BRISK RAIDERS

Boy do the Brisks suck. Honestly, there was a time when I thought the raiders pwned. Needless to say I was an H5 noob then. Truth is, in battle, once you actually start using them they usually die, and fast. Grims are the way to go here though, as at least you get the charge bonus. Then you just hope for luck, basically. Build them early, and let them breed until endgame. Please don't use them on ghosts when battling a Necro. If at all possible, steal the retaliation before you use them. That way the opponent at least will have to kill them. If you have to use them in creeping (say, there may be a situation when you don't want to use hit&run on neutrals and you just don't have enough mana/SP... Avalon and the garrison with birds and elementals comes to mind), make sure you upgrade them to grims so at least they don't die as fast.

5. HYDRA-DEEP HYDRA-FOUL HYDRA

This is honestly the best creature here. Hard to kill, great in endgame, no retaliation. Again, build them early, let them breed, do the upgrade once you have to use them. By then you will probably wish to dump the regeneration ability and go with the foul hydra seeing as how it can do damage even while it's dying which eventually you know it will.

6. SHADOW WITCH-SHADOW MATRIARCH-SHADOW MISTRESS

I don't build them unless it's a large map, even then only after I've built the dragons... the numbers don't matter here, it's the spellcasting, particulary slow, confusion, and righteous might. I usually take the mistresses for late creeping as those slows and confusions may come in handy in combination with my sorcery. Ditto in endgame battle. Invisibility is probably more for creeping, unless we have initiative bonuses and high morale.

7. SHADOW DRAGON-BLACK DRAGON-RED DRAGON

Honestly, the reds are trash. I mean, the same money as BD and you know they will die like flies. You buy yourself some dragons you at least hope it won't be a distant stack of rune keepers that finishes them off. This is strictly endgame stuff though. If you anticipate a 7-8 week long game, you should probably build them asap and let them breed. Even then you have to be sure you will have enough gold and resource for everything else you might need. Oh, and don't waste them on creeping.

To be continued... fire away your comments (I probably forgot a lot of stuff)!!

Tomorrow - early creeping challenges and skills.








 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
sq79
sq79


Famous Hero
posted March 26, 2008 08:18 AM

Sinitar can be better, the best start is sinitar + vayshan in tavern. Rush to secrets of destruction, if u get firewall, that's it , go for utopia on week1 if there's any If not, rush to level 3 in magic guild, firewall or ball will do just as fine.
If not other spells will do fine too.
This dungeon nowadays don't need furies to creep, though its a classic in hof and before.
Furies in battle field causes more problems in the creep for now.
Don't be afraid of losses for stalkers while creeping, there's there just to help with creeps, in final battle 5 or 50 doesn't matter, all die in first turn anyway

Minotaurs are useless troops, shadow witch is there to counter counterspell if opponent happens to get it.
Split the furies to block opponent from reaching.

Most of us in toh don't play dungeon much anymore because of the stalkers ability and new perks , we consider them overpowered and too easy to play Hope patch 3.1 is better if there's any

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
[ This thread is 61 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 (44) 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 ] < Prev Thread . . . Next Thread >
Post New Poll †† Post New Topic †† Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1178 seconds