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Sligneris
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 06:45 PM |
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Could we change the subject? No one ever learns a thing from these debates, no one is ever convinced, and frankly, there were too many discussions like this that literally achieved nothing.
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Zeki
Supreme Hero
sup
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posted April 02, 2015 06:45 PM |
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fuChris said:
Zeki said:
TOP.LEVEL.MANAGEMENT
The only thing management care about are budgeting, release dates and the returns on the investments.
Whatever else the working peasants(developers) do with the game they just don't give a sh*t about.
That is why they didn't give a cr*p about BH going bankrupt because the game made enough revenue.
So Erwan is still rightfully considered to be the Great Satan.
That might actually be one of the best case scenarios. But as Erwan said in the interview they did have a say in more matters. I don't remember what it was exactly and frankly said i don't wanna whatch the whole interview again to find that part. It's because there is one more thing that the management cares about that you didn't list. It's wheter they even want to invest or not and at this part they wanna see concepts and explantations why said concepts might pay off.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 06:47 PM |
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Zeki said:
Stevie said:
PandaTar said:
Yet, who is the one really in charge? In the end, it all comes to it, the source, the one who holds the power to say 'yes' or 'no'.
ERWAN. LE. BRETON.
He has the highest authority for the M&M Franchise inside Ubisoft. He holds the supreme power of allowing or vetoing ANY feature of the game. People failing to understand this simple fact even after all this time is ridiculous beyond reason.
TOP.LEVEL.MANAGEMENT
It has the highest authority for the M&M Franchise inside Ubisoft. It holds the supreme power of allowing or vetoing ANY feature of the game. People failing to understand this simple fact even after all this time *are ridiculous beyond reason.
I mean i don't want to defend Erwan, he does have his part in what the Might and Magic franchise is like today but he is not almighty (though he probably likes to think that way  ). In the end it's the big guys with the money who make the final decisions. He did actually even mention this a few Times in your interview. By the way this is also what i think goes wrong in today's Gaming industry. A game is not really a game anymore but an economic product. Only what the money givers think would sell will be made with the problem being that they neither now nor care about what gamer really want.
YOU. ARE. WRONG.
Top level management, as FuChris said, is just the one that cares about the product at a market level. It does not care about what the product is or contains. It just gives the cash and the rights, in this case to Erwan le Breton, and expects back profit. It has no part whatsoever in the design of the game, that's the Creative Director's job.
And I think I know what he said in the interview, and yes, ELB has a boss(es). That doesn't mean that his boss is responsible for Ashan or the M&M IP, which btw ELB called "his baby".
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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Sligneris
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 06:49 PM |
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Sligneris said:
Could we change the subject? No one ever learns a thing from these debates, no one is ever convinced, and frankly, there were too many discussions like this that literally achieved nothing.
Looks like we can't...
Stevie said:
And I think I know what he said in the interview, and yes, ELB has a boss(es). That doesn't mean that his boss is responsible for Ashan or the M&M IP, which btw ELB called "his baby".
You know, the Ashan universe isn't just Heroes 6. Erwan Le Breton created Ashan, but it doesn't mean he can be blamed for every single thing done wrong in any game set in this universe.
Galaad said:
I might wanna stress in Ubisoft as a company actually are huge fans of Warcraft.
How's that a bad thing?
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted April 02, 2015 06:49 PM |
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Edited by Galaad at 18:53, 02 Apr 2015.
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I might wanna stress in Ubisoft as a company actually are huge fans of Warcraft.
Quote:
Pretty sure that the Ashan universe =/= just Heroes 6. We discussed the quality of Heroes 6, not the setting.
Pretty sure that the Ashan universe is closer to Heroes 6 than any other Ubi Heroes, and hopefully Arachnopolis in Heroes 7 might not turn out as horrific as it was originally intended to be.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 06:52 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 19:03, 02 Apr 2015.
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Sligneris said:
Pretty sure that the Ashan universe =/= just Heroes 6. We discussed the quality of Heroes 6, not the setting.
Galaad said:
I might wanna stress in Ubisoft as a company actually are huge fans of Warcraft.
How's that a bad thing?
Pretty sure Heroes 6 is part of the M&M IP, which is the Creative Director's baby.
Oh and btw, IP means more than just lore. it means visuals, concepts, even mechanics, etc.
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted April 02, 2015 06:59 PM |
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Edited by verriker at 19:01, 02 Apr 2015.
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Sligneris said:
You know, the Ashan universe isn't just Heroes 6. Erwan Le Breton created Ashan, but it doesn't mean he can be blamed for every single thing done wrong in any game set in this universe.
no argument there, but he can be blamed for every single thing done wrong in the world, flavor and story departments, and he can be blamed for Heroes 6 lol
he can also be praised for TotE and Clash of Heroes, which is only fair, but you people trying to divert blame away where it's warranted crack me up lol
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GenyaArikado
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:02 PM |
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LizardWarrior said:
The best? Dude, a blind chimpanzee which could write only the first 3 letters of the alphabet could conceive a deeper story with a much more immersive plot than that h6 crap for which they hired a special department. I could have forgive them if it was just put together by a few programmers and art designers in a hurry during a lunch break because they needed a story. But to actually hire people whose only job was to make a story, excuse me, but that must be some kind of joke
go ahead then. I must have been drunk (at age 13 somehow) and missed the transcendental, unique and experimental plot of H3 and how "my dad turned evil by evil necromancers" is better than "my dad is going to become an angel vessel by evil angels"
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:04 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 19:06, 02 Apr 2015.
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ELB interview, 4:05
Me: "What exactly does it mean to be the Creative Director of the M&M Franchise?"
ELB: "It means a lot of things. It means you're totally related to everything that's part of the content and the experience of the games. So it's obviously art and music and audio and game design and story, the lore of the universe. It's also about consistency of all the games together[...]".
PEOPLE, GET YOUR HEAD AROUND THAT ALREADY!
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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Zeki
Supreme Hero
sup
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posted April 02, 2015 07:08 PM |
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Stevie said:
And I think I know what he said in the interview, and yes, ELB has a boss(es). That doesn't mean that his boss is responsible for Ashan or the M&M IP, which btw ELB called "his baby".
It might be true that i think too high of how much influence the management has but i could also be wrong. These are internal things that we'll never know about. i just wanted to point out that in his reasoning Erwan might not only think about how to piss of Ashan-haters but also what might be profitable.
Sligneris said:
Sligneris said:
Could we change the subject? No one ever learns a thing from these debates, no one is ever convinced, and frankly, there were too many discussions like this that literally achieved nothing.
Looks like we can't...
You're free to talk about whatever you like, nobody forces you
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Sligneris
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:08 PM |
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I still do not see it - even your sources state that at some point, Erwan Le Breton stopped being involved with Heroes 6's development, and others brought up that Heroes 6 had separate writing team.
He's responsible for Ashan, admittedly. Yet, I don't see how it's as bad as people tend to claim. I haven't heard many understandable complaints as to what's so bad about it. Are fans that much bothered that it's not the same world as the old universe? That is... rather silly complaint.
Stevie said:
ELB interview, 4:05
Me: "What exactly does it mean to be the Creative Director of the M&M Franchise?"
ELB: "It means a lot of things. It means you're totally related to everything that's part of the content and the experience of the games. So it's obviously art and music and audio and game design and story, the lore of the universe. It's also about consistency of all the games together[...]".
PEOPLE, GET YOUR HEAD AROUND THAT ALREADY!
I think you don't understand. He is in charge, but he does not create the content himself - being connected to story, music and art, doesn't mean that it's him who writes the story, composes music or prepares the artwork. That's mostly my point about why I think it's silly to accuse him of everything.
That being said, he is indeed doing terrible job in supervising the series - there are some thing that shouldn't have passed.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted April 02, 2015 07:11 PM |
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Edited by Galaad at 19:14, 02 Apr 2015.
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Zeki said:
i just wanted to point out that in his reasoning Erwan might not only think about how to piss of Ashan-haters but also what might be profitable.
Of course he considers P&L (or tries to).
Quote:
That's mostly my point about why I think it's silly to accuse him of everything.
*sigh*
Did you even watch, the interview?
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PandaTar
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Celestial Heavens Mascot
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posted April 02, 2015 07:14 PM |
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Why haven't you continued with your fork-motion, Galaad? All this is your fault! Without Erwan to blame for all miserable things happening in our world (Earth), we would be pretty much happier! 
You could blame Spiderman for the assassination and be done with it.
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"Okay. Look. We both said a lot of things that you're going to regret. But I think we can put our differences behind us. For science. You monster."
GlaDOS – Portal 2
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted April 02, 2015 07:15 PM |
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Edited by Galaad at 19:18, 02 Apr 2015.
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PandaTar said:
You could blame Spiderman for the assassination and be done with it.
Then Spiderman would blame it on the Joker, but I love Luke Skywalker.
ppP-P-PAAAAAANDA !!
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fuChris
Promising
Supreme Hero
Master to the Speed of Light
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posted April 02, 2015 07:15 PM |
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GenyaArikado said:
go ahead then. I must have been drunk (at age 13 somehow) and missed the transcendental, unique and experimental plot of H3 and how "my dad turned evil by evil necromancers" is better than "my dad is going to become an angel vessel by evil angels"
It's really about a mediocre story told well in the case of H3 and a bad story told mediocre in the case of H6.
I still see no reason why we couldn't return to H4 levels of storytelling.
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"Now I am become Chris, the destroyer of worlds." - Robert Oppenheimer.
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Zombi_Wizzard
Famous Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:16 PM |
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Sligneris said:
I think you don't understand. He is in charge, but he does not create the content himself - being connected to story, music and art, doesn't mean that it's him who writes the story, composes music or prepares the artwork. That's mostly my point about why I think it's silly to accuse him of everything.
Ummm ... No he does not create himself those things by his own hand, but he more or less shouts: "Oj, art guy, draw me an emo looking Vampire that drinks spider saliva and looks like Arthas!"
And they do. They are paid to do it.
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Sligneris
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:17 PM |
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fuChris said:
It's really about a mediocre story told well in the case of H3 and a bad story told mediocre in the case of H6.
How about a good story told badly, like in the case of H5? This game could have been so much more... 
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GenyaArikado
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:18 PM |
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fuChris said:
GenyaArikado said:
go ahead then. I must have been drunk (at age 13 somehow) and missed the transcendental, unique and experimental plot of H3 and how "my dad turned evil by evil necromancers" is better than "my dad is going to become an angel vessel by evil angels"
It's really about a mediocre story told well in the case of H3 and a bad story told mediocre in the case of H6.
I still see no reason why we couldn't return to H4 levels of storytelling.
why is it bad and why do you consider it badly told?
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Sligneris
Supreme Hero
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posted April 02, 2015 07:19 PM |
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Like I say, I hate Heroes 6 mostly because it was a horribly wasted opportunity show us the story of Tuidhana's secession, including the creation of Dark Elves.
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted April 02, 2015 07:20 PM |
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Sligneris said:
How about a good story told badly, like in the case of H5? This game could have been so much more...
sorry, but Heroes 5 was a bad story told badly lol
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