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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 10:51 AM |
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Elvin said:
It does actually, as has been stated before. You just choose to discard it because it does not match your opinion.
They used to work with elves. Or with elves in general.
But in Ashan, regarding H5 and H6 and even Clash of Heroes,NO.
They did bring them for nostalgia and I have a suspicion that balance was to be the foretress of the poll, but they miscalculated the fans' need for a flying unit.
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blob2
Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
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posted September 16, 2014 10:52 AM |
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Edited by blob2 at 10:58, 16 Sep 2014.
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I don't see a problem with Phoenixes in an Elven town, as long as the town itself is close to Nature. The problem appears if it's more of a LotR-ish elven town (we still are not 100% sure how this faction will look in H7, even if we look through the whole lore thing). It just doesn't suit their elegant and stoic nature imo (Phoenixes are creatures of pure and chaotic elements, though some cultures like to picture them as dignified so I don't know  ). I think that a Phoenix, having a strong affinity to magic, fits into a "Nature" faction as it is a place that attracts creatures with strong affinity to magic. You can say Academy is similar, but it is more of a man-made, scientific magic, not primal, elemental magic like in the case with a "green" town (it was highly accented in H4, where each faction was linked with aspects of being like order/chaos, life/death etc).
Oh and if someone sees it as canon, back in NWC H5 days, Phoenixes would return to their H1-H2 roots:
@ChrisD1
You forget that creatures change their affinities in Heroes universe, even on a whim
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blizz
Known Hero
of temper grace
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posted September 16, 2014 10:59 AM |
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Edited by blizz at 11:02, 16 Sep 2014.
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Stevie said:
Phoenix obviously doesn't work with Elves. The only reason for it getting included is because of fans' nostalgia for that particular creature. Besides that, nothing. It doesn't fit the faction nor it's lore in the slightest. I think they would fit very well with Academy myself, but even better had as neutral creatures. But not with Elves, that's just retarded.
Coming from a guy who said he doesn't care about line-ups and creatures. Please. I bet you wouldn't mind Phoenix in fury if it happened.
Blowing things out of proportions for polls sake indeed.
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:17 AM |
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blizz said:
Coming from a guy who said he doesn't care about line-ups and creatures. Please. I bet you wouldn't mind Phoenix in fury if it happened.
Blowing things out of proportions for polls sake indeed.
The reason some of us want Fury is the lack of the Phoenix in it. Not "just because".
blob2 said:
@ChrisD1
You forget that creatures change their affinities in Heroes universe, even on a whim
And now I'm dying to see a moon imp in Sylvan,because it was on a whim.
Guys nomatter how you are gonna sell it Phoenix is a creature best left for Academy (which is actually included as a "magic bird").
You want a flying unit in Sylvan? Good. Phoenix is here to stay apparently.
But don't try to say it fits Sylvan because last century it went well there. It's Ashan now.
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natalka
Supreme Hero
Bad-mannered
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posted September 16, 2014 11:24 AM |
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read carefully that it is a snake and an archer
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 16, 2014 11:24 AM |
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ChrisD1 said:
But don't try to say it fits Sylvan because last century it went well there. It's Ashan now.
I'm getting tired of this argument. You people saying that would be the first ones infuriated if Ashan happens to get scraped or drastically changed. Ashan did alter the franchise, this is fact. Plus Phoenix does not mean burn the forest, how many times how many people will need to explain that.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:26 AM |
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Elvin said:
It does actually, as has been stated before. You just choose to discard it because it does not match your opinion.
Besides NWC Elves and the rebirth cycle argument which is entirely besides the point I didn't see any real arguments connecting the Phoenix to the Ashan Elves lore.
blizz said:
Coming from a guy who said he doesn't care about line-ups and creatures. Please. I bet you wouldn't mind Phoenix in fury if it happened.
Blowing things out of proportions for polls sake indeed.
Right back at you. Ignoring inconsistencies for polls sake.
As long as creatures is an argument for voting or not voting a line-up for some, I will debate that for their sake and for the sake of my interests. So don't act like you hold the moral high-ground when it's a race for votes. What matters are the arguments and not the motives.
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Alex_Yakub
Famous Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:26 AM |
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natalka said:
read carefully that it is a snake and an archer
It says on the main site that root snake is a fast unit that piosons and entangles it's enemies. No word about shooting.
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hammerhand
Hired Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:30 AM |
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ChrisD1 said:
blizz said:
Coming from a guy who said he doesn't care about line-ups and creatures. Please. I bet you wouldn't mind Phoenix in fury if it happened.
Blowing things out of proportions for polls sake indeed.
The reason some of us want Fury is the lack of the Phoenix in it. Not "just because".
blob2 said:
@ChrisD1
You forget that creatures change their affinities in Heroes universe, even on a whim
And now I'm dying to see a moon imp in Sylvan,because it was on a whim.
Guys nomatter how you are gonna sell it Phoenix is a creature best left for Academy (which is actually included as a "magic bird").
You want a flying unit in Sylvan? Good. Phoenix is here to stay apparently.
But don't try to say it fits Sylvan because last century it went well there. It's Ashan now.
ok we don't talk about early homm games£¬we talk about cultures£¬some people include me have show that pheonixes can live in forest in many cultures and stories£¬why not in ashan£¿
and ubi never said pheonix don't fit sylvan as far as I know£¬so why did you said that£¿
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RMZ1989
Supreme Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:40 AM |
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hammerhand said:
ChrisD1 said:
blizz said:
Coming from a guy who said he doesn't care about line-ups and creatures. Please. I bet you wouldn't mind Phoenix in fury if it happened.
Blowing things out of proportions for polls sake indeed.
The reason some of us want Fury is the lack of the Phoenix in it. Not "just because".
blob2 said:
@ChrisD1
You forget that creatures change their affinities in Heroes universe, even on a whim
And now I'm dying to see a moon imp in Sylvan,because it was on a whim.
Guys nomatter how you are gonna sell it Phoenix is a creature best left for Academy (which is actually included as a "magic bird").
You want a flying unit in Sylvan? Good. Phoenix is here to stay apparently.
But don't try to say it fits Sylvan because last century it went well there. It's Ashan now.
ok we don't talk about early homm games£¬we talk about cultures£¬some people include me have show that pheonixes can live in forest in many cultures and stories£¬why not in ashan£¿
and ubi never said pheonix don't fit sylvan as far as I know£¬so why did you said that£¿
They've never said that Phoenixes don't fit Sylvan, but we have Phoenixes as summoning units in Heroes 5(Ashan universe), we have Phoenixes as Academy units in Clash of Heroes(Ashan universe) and we have Phoenixes as neutral creatures in Duel of Champions(Ashan universe) and now, SUDDENLY Phoenixes belong to Sylvan?
I admit, I hate this unit with passion, but even if I didn't, this is absolutely ridiculous.
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Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted September 16, 2014 11:51 AM |
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Galaad said:
All this Phoenix hate.. Incults posting nonsense getting 60+ up votes on official website, depressing. And the Academy magic bird's argument doesn't work for me as a) it will probably be different creature and b) huh, will someone actually pick Magic Bird when you have such awesome Titan ?
IDK:. depends on how he playes. Or the entire faction playes
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ChrisD1
Supreme Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 11:56 AM |
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Birds are the new Dragons.
You say you don't want many humanoids in one faction but you want more birds in the entire game!
I really wanna see a vulture-like thing with orcs! or a naga! things change
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Sleeping_Sun
Promising
Famous Hero
Townscreen Architect
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posted September 16, 2014 12:12 PM |
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RMZ1989 said:
They've never said that Phoenixes don't fit Sylvan, but we have Phoenixes as summoning units in Heroes 5(Ashan universe), we have Phoenixes as Academy units in Clash of Heroes(Ashan universe) and we have Phoenixes as neutral creatures in Duel of Champions(Ashan universe) and now, SUDDENLY Phoenixes belong to Sylvan?
I admit, I hate this unit with passion, but even if I didn't, this is absolutely ridiculous.
So what if Phoenix changed factions throughout the games? Griffin has changed as well (Warlock H1 and H2, Castle H3, Nature H4, Haven H5 and H6). Why don't you all argue that Griffin doesn't belong to Haven? Some people like the fact that Griffin is no longer in line-up, but some people don't like it.
As much as I have read HC and mmh7 site, no one has come up with a good argument why Phoenix doesn't belong to the faction. The statements of "burning down the forests" and "oh, it is the second unit which is a bird" are just ridicules statements of people with no brains and lack of imagination, since this is an imaginary fantasy world created in virtual environment where logic needs not to be apply since it is not a real life, and since it is developer's adaptation of already existing lore, mythology, etc.
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"The age can be wicked to those who walk alone. When I look into the Mirror, I see myself as I might become..." -Freya
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VOKIALBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
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posted September 16, 2014 12:14 PM |
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Stevie said:
RMZ1989 said:
Because you know, that was old universe where factions were a thematic mixes of random creatures. Now that factions are closer to races, some things just doesn't make sense. Not because it doesn't make sense to us, but because Ubisoft is inconsistent with their choices and which units belong to which faction.
Exactly this.
Phoenix obviously doesn't work with Elves. The only reason for it getting included is because of fans' nostalgia for that particular creature. Besides that, nothing. It doesn't fit the faction nor it's lore in the slightest. I think they would fit very well with Academy myself, but even better had as neutral creatures. But not with Elves, that's just retarded.
It works perfectly. It was there originally in the pre H3 games and in H4. There is its place. But they MUST remove the magic bird at all imo and also put the unicorn in and remove the snake thing.
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NACHOOOO
Known Hero
Pessimistically optimistic
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posted September 16, 2014 12:16 PM |
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ChrisD1 said:
Birds are the new Dragons.
You say you don't want many humanoids in one faction but you want more birds in the entire game!
I really wanna see a vulture-like thing with orcs! or a naga! things change
Agreed. Would much rather a paokai/wyvern or vulture rider in stronghold than a pheonix in Sylvan. I think the strength option is perfect but it's been getting hosed these last few days.
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted September 16, 2014 12:27 PM |
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NACHOOOO said:
I think the strength option is perfect but it's been getting hosed these last few days.
Lacks flyers. Unicorn + Phoenix in the same lineup is the only true one.
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red_flag
Known Hero
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posted September 16, 2014 12:28 PM |
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Very nice forest phoenix (if it can be named like this) picture
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NACHOOOO
Known Hero
Pessimistically optimistic
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posted September 16, 2014 12:33 PM |
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Galaad said:
NACHOOOO said:
I think the strength option is perfect but it's been getting hosed these last few days.
Lacks flyers. Unicorn + Phoenix in the same lineup is the only true one.
Has it been confirmed the Emerald Dragon can't fly? It just says it has average range
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Magic Bird, only a working
title. Phew
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blizz
Known Hero
of temper grace
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posted September 16, 2014 12:33 PM |
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red_flag said:
Very nice forest phoenix (if it can be named like this) picture
That actually looks amazing and perfectly fitting for Sylvan.
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VOKIALBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
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posted September 16, 2014 12:33 PM |
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Galaad said:
NACHOOOO said:
I think the strength option is perfect but it's been getting hosed these last few days.
Lacks flyers. Unicorn + Phoenix in the same lineup is the only true one.
Same here. Its the best one.
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