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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions This Popular Thread is 196 pages long: 1 20 40 60 80 100 120 ... 137 138 139 140 141 ... 160 180 196 · «PREV / NEXT»
Gandalf196
Gandalf196


Disgraceful
Supreme Hero
posted May 05, 2020 11:10 PM

Phoenix4ever said:
But Mana Vortex costs only 1000 gold and has double the effect of Expert Intelligence! Why should Intelligence be cut in half, but very cheap and easy to build Mana Vortex is still a-okay, it does'nt make sense to me.
Yeah Mage Guild 2 or 3 could be a requirement, but it still seems to powerful compared to Intelligence.
Also notice that AI can't build Mana Vortex, so the more powerful this building is, the more we f*** up the AI.


Good points!
Also, Mana vortex belongs to the wizards (tower), not in a dungeon. Might and Magic Heroes VII was the first heroes game to correct this.
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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted May 05, 2020 11:58 PM

gatecrasher said:
Regarding new warmachines, I think (and hope) we'll rather get new skins and a change in stats than groundbreaking new mechanics.

If the First Aid skill is to be made worthwhile something has to be done about the tent, too.


I think big changes will happen to war machines reagardless how it's been done. Most likely situation is that "only" some stats will change, and the biggest changes are targeted towards war machine skills. However, something like unique war machines could still happen, as it was in the teams scope in the early years. One could call them old plans, but it was during the current year when Docent himself clarified that the plans of Kronverk and Cathedral were never thrown to the trash bin, even they're plans from 2007-2008.

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Legendary Hero
DoR Modder
posted May 06, 2020 11:05 AM
Edited by FirePaladin at 23:28, 06 May 2020.

Small Portraits (only changed which are possible with the current pallete:

Btw, just noticed that in the small portrait for the Silver Pegasi, the pegas has no armor on the front (besides the un-curved sword).

Also, the nagas' bras are smaller than they really are in their portraits.

For their head angle, Master Gremlins' hat should be extending on the back (now it looks like a turban).

Stone Golems have helmets in both portraits (the unit sprite is bald).

Crusader's shoulders could need some more gold.

Champion's horse's armor has no sections.

Both Efreeti's small beard seems to be missing? Having analyzed their sprites, looks like it's just some black outline, just as it was with the Efreeti's "bugged" original adventure map sprite.

Arch Devils look like they have 2 "horns" on their shoulders instead of 1.

Base troglodyte could get a spear too.

Base Harpy could have her bra somewhat bigger, especially on the portrait's right.

Medusa Queens look as if they are naked in the portrait.

Blackie's "mouth" is quite green. Lower jaw should be black instead of yellow.

Ogre Magi's belt medallion could have a darker tone of gold.

Thunderbird's head looks somewhat different than the unit (especially missing the feathers on the head).

Both Basilisks could get longer fangs.

Creature Sprites:

Serpent Flies have a transparent pixel over their eye in one of their sprite frames for move.
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"Goblins use pistols because a shotgun recoil would kick them off the ground flying."
The Reckoning.... it's drawing near....

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Romanov77
Romanov77


Known Hero
posted May 06, 2020 11:39 PM

A few ideas on skills:

The warmachine issue could be solved by merging Ballistic, Artillery and First Aid in a single "War Machines" skill.
Lazy solution, but could be easy to implement.

Reworking single skills:

Artillery: dramatically improve damage of ballista. It doesn't have to be just raw damage numbers, the skill could add effects like Gorgon death stare or other debuffs.
Maybe a flat damage proportional to the enemy stack size so the machine stays relevant through endgame. A small siege tower damage buff would also be nice.

First aid: easy. Make the tent capable of resurrecting. Not dramatically high, just enough to make Expert worth getting.

Ballistics: always found it as a very specific skill, some other perk could really encourage me to pick it.

Now Eagle Eye...
I think it could work this way:
Hero has a chance to learn ANY spell cast during battles happening on the map. Even the ones involving other allied heroes or enemy heroes. Red wizard gets dimension door? Watch out, that dumb blue barbarian really has a feeling for the "winds of magic" or whatever and might learn it.
I think this would add an interesting risk-reward system in advanced spell casting, even when trashing neutrals, as the enemy might learn your precious implosion, or God forbids, your town portal!
Needless to say, spells would need to be learned without the usual wisdom requirement.
With finely tuned percentages, it could be a very useful tool for factions with poor guilds like Fortress and Stronghold.
My only doubt is...does AI actually cast spells during neutral fights? I fought many AI heroes with depleted mana so I think it does, but I am not versed in the internal mechanics of the game.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted May 07, 2020 12:19 AM
Edited by bloodsucker at 00:23, 07 May 2020.

Romanov77 said:

Now Eagle Eye...
I think it could work this way:
Hero has a chance to learn ANY spell cast during battles happening on the map. Even the ones involving other allied heroes or enemy heroes. Red wizard gets dimension door? Watch out, that dumb blue barbarian really has a feeling for the "winds of magic" or whatever and might learn it.
I think this would add an interesting risk-reward system in advanced spell casting, even when trashing neutrals, as the enemy might learn your precious implosion, or God forbids, your town portal!
Needless to say, spells would need to be learned without the usual wisdom requirement.

So, you would need Expert Wisdom to learn Fly from your own mage guild that costed you 28 of each special resource, plus a ton of wood, ore and gold and you spent five turns building. Your enemy OTOH would catch you flying around and learn it without even Basic Wisdom. Great!
I love these well thought proposals...
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Romanov77
Romanov77


Known Hero
posted May 07, 2020 06:07 AM

That wouldn't be a 100% chance.

But yeah, that's a little too overpowered.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted May 07, 2020 11:03 AM

You were thinking "How can this work for this player?" and forgot "How will this break it to the other?". It happens to me all the time, too.
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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted May 07, 2020 12:14 PM
Edited by Hourglass at 12:14, 07 May 2020.

Well, tbh the part of not requiring Wisdom doesn't make much sense, as Wisdom is literally there to make your hero learn the spells in the first place.

So, if the player would need correct level of wisdom, I don't even think the buffed Eagle Eye would be that useful. Possibly it could be really good if you're facing an AI player in a custom map where the player and the AI are starting unevenly - like you're up against some kind of superhero with crazy spells right from the beginning. Or if you're playing a game with many human players.

But any kind of "normal" scenario, it literally would only allow you to match enemy spells. This wouldn't even be that helpful if many AI players would be present, as they don't usually build high level mage guilds + the AI doesn't have the same kind fighting capabilities as the player does, so AI cannot deal with guards with high level spells as rewards early on anyway. And if the player couldn't be able to get high level spells from this investment early on, I don't see how it would be unfair.

If Eagle Eye is going to remain in the game in any form that even slightly reminds the original skill, I think this could be one option.

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gatecrasher
gatecrasher


Famous Hero
posted May 07, 2020 12:43 PM

Romanov77 said:
That wouldn't be a 100% chance.

But yeah, that's a little too overpowered.


Not at all. I for one still would not pick it.
In the best case this would allow you to catch up with an enemy who is about to win anyway.

Aside from that, even if this new Eagle Eyeing would only apply to already uncovered it would be quite a stretch of the (already ridiculous) eagle eye metaphor.

I'm all for ditching the skill altogether, no matter whether or not a new one will be introduced.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted May 07, 2020 01:08 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 13:09, 07 May 2020.

gatecrasher said:
I'm all for ditching the skill altogether, no matter whether or not a new one will be introduced.
That's what I'm doing already, I removed it (along with Learning and other less useful stuff) from the templates I'm creating with the new Template Editor (thx again, Gruk) but I do believe 27 skills to be too many for 8 slots only.
I would have a different opinion if they were 10 slots or at least there was some form of Market of Time available.
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Phoenix4ever
Phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted May 07, 2020 01:48 PM

bloodsucker said:

I would have a different opinion if they were 10 slots or at least there was some form of Market of Time available.

Yes, that's what I have been saying for a long time.

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Ghost
Ghost


Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
posted May 07, 2020 03:10 PM

Much better had more new skill. Add 11 new skills, it makes a total of 40! The next of Market of Time, it gives extra two skill. Ok so player could be harder to get a Earth, for example. Remember that not  existence of the best skills. When Elite III is coming, Tocath explains some opponent chooses the best skill, he/she doesn't choose improved skill, because it's always be bad, etc But material vs spirit. HoMM distributor doesn't go to break. It gives your skill, what you've developed way also it feels/knows the strategy. But player decides what he/she wants skill. Other every games haven't all the best skill, opening, material, object. Example of speed, power and size in sport game. Some only plays spirit or material with. Remember if player plays different, it's more beautiful game in showing. In Finland, EAsport Ice Hockey, player must know over 20 different goals, he/she can come tournament along, etc So because much better is more new skill. You can start at Mining skill, for example. It after Market of Time.
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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Legendary Hero
DoR Modder
posted May 07, 2020 04:01 PM

Many big portraits of units are different than the creature itself, possibly because of using older 3D models and the H3 team forgetting/not bothering with correcting them. S. Gargoyles have big claws, flies have only 1 pair of wings, Master Gremlins have turban, Titans have no elaborate shoulder armor and have a "crispy" look on it (same for Medusa Queens), Blackies are pretty yellow, Trogs have no spear...
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"Goblins use pistols because a shotgun recoil would kick them off the ground flying."
The Reckoning.... it's drawing near....

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Romanov77
Romanov77


Known Hero
posted May 07, 2020 04:26 PM

What do you guys think about my warmachines suggestions?

First aid tent resurrection seems like a no brainer choice for Expert First aid...does it work this way in V? Cannot remember.
Healing/resurrection power could be tied to hero levels or maybe to Defense level.


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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Legendary Hero
DoR Modder
posted May 07, 2020 04:29 PM

Romanov77 said:
What do you guys think about my warmachines suggestions?

First aid tent resurrection seems like a no brainer choice for Expert First aid...does it work this way in V? Cannot remember.
Healing/resurrection power could be tied to hero levels or maybe to Defense level.




Don't be offended, but I really lost the flow of the discussion after everyone started talking about weak skills like Eagle-eye and war-machines. I lack interest in that area. Plus, I believe HotA team already has decided what they will do with them.
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"Goblins use pistols because a shotgun recoil would kick them off the ground flying."
The Reckoning.... it's drawing near....

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted May 09, 2020 11:36 AM

Romanov77 said:
What do you guys think about my warmachines suggestions?

First aid tent resurrection seems like a no brainer choice for Expert First aid...does it work this way in V? Cannot remember.
Healing/resurrection power could be tied to hero levels or maybe to Defense level.



While the resurection tent might seem like an obvious way to go, it could lead into some unhealthy battles, where players simply delay the fight forever in order to resurect their whole army. This could be done by leaving a slow(ed) small stack that is lured around the battlefield by one fast troop. It could be argued that the same can be done currently by simply spamming resurection, but it needs a ton of mana in order to do so.


And now, my final war machine suggestion, now each faction has it's own war machine:

Weapon cart

While melee attacking, if the target enemy defence is stronger than your attack, the total damage is increased by 5%.

Only usable by Stronghold. Uses the ammo cart slot.

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Legendary Hero
DoR Modder
posted May 09, 2020 11:38 AM
Edited by FirePaladin at 12:01, 09 May 2020.

First Aid Tent Resurrection could use some mana, though.

Edit: @phoenix4ever that too. I'm thinking about 3 uses.
____________
"Goblins use pistols because a shotgun recoil would kick them off the ground flying."
The Reckoning.... it's drawing near....

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Phoenix4ever
Phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted May 09, 2020 11:58 AM

It could also have a limited number of "resurrections" to prevent abuse.

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted May 09, 2020 12:45 PM

I'm not sure about the mana, as the tent is an object of it's own, and not exactly related to the hero. I mean other creatures like Ogre Magi can cast spells without caring about your mana.

Fixed amount sounds better, but I'm not personally feel combining the warmachine skills together would make most sense. Therefore, the tent related skill doesn't have to be so strong invidually, as the power of the skill would come from multiple instances.

If any kind of resurection events should happen, I feel making them trigger after the battle would make most sense (doesn't obviosly happen if the tent is destroyed). Like the resurection skill in Homm4.

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zmudziak22
zmudziak22


Supreme Hero
Heroes 3 Fan
posted May 09, 2020 01:29 PM

IF we talk about War Machines:

Artillery(Ballista and Cannon), all specialists should have knowledge of these two an improve them. Make attack war machines scales damage as combo of attack + knowledge, like heroes 5 + it should increase health of ballista/canon up to 500 hp. Expert Artillery could make Ballista/Canon ignore 40-60% of enemy defense for better damage(also like heroes 5)

Tent:
Necromancers could have alternative tent called Plaque tent, which it would debuff enemy creatures(wyvern poision, zombie deseases, curse, weaksness etc)
Aid Tent - flat hp restoration, limited resurection uses(could be up to 3, each resurrection 100 hp like 1 Archangel)

Ballistics:
Catapult While you attack town walls, you have chance of hurting creatures close to walls(like accurate shots of Sea Dogs)
Ammo cart: not only would provide unlimited shots, but also give precision attack bonus and slighty increase damage

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