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| Thread: 2006 FIFA World Cup Germany |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV |
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Truliche
Adventuring Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 07:01 AM |
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Edited by Truliche at 07:47, 14 Jul 2006.
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the golden ball shouldnt be taken away from zidane for one act.
he got france to the finals and one act shouldnt be enough to take away a very valuable prize. if zidane had punched someone in the group stages and had 2 red cards, then fifa would have a case. but that didnt happen. one thing isnt enough to take the golden ball away from zidane
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its not possible that a player that headbutts another one in such a controversial act and is later acknowledged as best player of the World Cup
what if a player headbutted another player in the first game of the world cup. then when the ban was finished this player played great. the player scored 2 goals in every game he played during the world cup. he put on a great show with tricks that made the crowd go wild. then in the final he scored the greatest ever individual goal. this player would be the best player at the world cup. he would have about 8 goals under his belt and showed he is the greatest player at the world cup so he wins the golden boot
should he be stripped of the award? he is clearly the best player. would you take the award off him?
No I wouldn't but clearly Zidane wasn't that kind of player, Cannavaro was much better and between him and Zidane, yeah its debatable and anyone could have won it fairly but once Zidane gets that under his belt... Cannavaro OBVIOUSLY earns a lead.
Get what I'm saying? In my opinion Cannavaro played tons better, Zidane played good but not as good as him, had he not headbutter Materazzi and he had won it, he would have been a worthy winner and probably more so than Cannavaro if the media really thought he was... but when you have such a tight competition between Cannavaro and Zidane... you just can't ignore Zidane's headbutt and have Cannavaro earned the silver ball when he played better than Zidane, helped his team accomplish their World Cup victory AND did not get a single yellow card throughout the competion, DESPITE being a defender.
See where I am getting at? I don't think FIFA should take away his prize but in any case... I'm not saying FIFA should take his prize away and I'm not saying it would be a bad decision either... I'm just saying that Cannavaro deserves the Golden Ball more than Zidane, especially if Zidane did something like that compared to Cannavaro's clean record, especially considering that technically speaking they were both pretty close.
Oh and by the way you should see Materazzi's declarations on the incident as compared to Zidane's... you should also take into account that the voting for Golden Ball winner were closed at half time, before the incident happened, so really its unfair to ignore all the headbutt controversy, that is why FIFA is thinking of removing his prize.
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Ecoris
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 12:05 PM |
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Why don't you guys start a new thread about this...
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you should also take into account that the voting for Golden Ball winner were closed at half time
I thought it closed at midnight. But that's still a problem since many journalists voted before the game ended.
IMO cannavaro (two n's) deserved the golden ball, but Zidane won it fair and square. Therefore you shouldn't take it away from him.
Second, we don't know what Materazzi actually said. The point is that whatever Materazzi said was a case between him and Zidane (since the ref didn't hear it), but when Zidane headbutted him he brought the game into misrepute in front of hundred of millions. Such a violent act can in no way be justified.
If Materazzi did say what Zidane claimed he should be penalized as well, but let us wait for the results of the hearing before we continue to post the same things over and over.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted July 14, 2006 02:38 PM |
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Second, we don't know what Materazzi actually said. The point is that whatever Materazzi said was a case between him and Zidane (since the ref didn't hear it), but when Zidane headbutted him he brought the game into misrepute in front of hundred of millions. Such a violent act can in no way be justified...
Sorry to say Ecoris, but this statement is far from being logic at all. I beat your younger brother in a small room where no other person is present. He runs to you and tells you what happened. You meet me right away in a hockey stadium watching a game and punch me right in the face while thousands of people look at us. So i am the good guy, and u r the bad guy?....think of it....
Materazzis behaviour is under investigation from the FIFA right now. With every day, Materazzi tells more of the truth and shows he lied from the very beginning. The whole tournament has to be seen to judge if someone earns the award. Cannavaro played an awesome tournament. Cannavaro was part of a great team, so his performance wasnīt that obvious for everyone.
But Zidane was the guy who brought France into the final...no1 else. His power in the game vs Spain was just awesome. He scored vs Brazil, he scored vs Italy. The whole team was at least 1 step away from his performance (my point of view), just similar to Oliver Kahn 2002. No other player of the german team 2002 was near that good. He brought them into the final. But he also got the reward after the final, even though his fault gave Brazil the lead...and even though Ronaldo scored awesome 8 goals.
And some words to Truliche aswell. I think u should put away your "italian" glasses also. You know the motto of that WC?
NO RACISM and no DISCRIMINATION. So if itīs only half the truth what Materazzi said to Zidane, he kicked the MAIN idea of the whole tournament. This is NOT common in every game like u said. And perhaps i am allowed to bring up the racism actions in some italian stadiums last season?...The specific italian player with his typical "gesticulation"? I guess u know what and who i mean....Fairplay takes ALL aspects into account...not only the obvious ones...
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 03:16 PM |
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clearly, in my mind, Zidane deserves to be stripped of his golden ball award. Hes an absolute disgrace, more so because of the way hes gone about it afterwards. He is calling for materazzi to be punished for his words. That is one of the most unsportsmanlike acts he could perform. He is trying to protect his own ass by puttin the blame on someone else. Materazzi is not responsible for this incident. The blame falls heavily on Zidane. Sure materazzi might have said something, bt that doesnt mean anything in my book. Besides id believe materazzi over a dirty cheat like zidane anyday. I have lost all respect for zidane, his career means nothing to me now. He cost his side the world cup in my opinion, and he let down millions of children, becoming 1 of the worst role-models for young children, not only because of the action but the way hes gone about it afterward. Zidane needs to grow up, open his eyes, and realise hes got penalties he has to face for his actions. Why did he explode? He exploded because he knew it was his last game, nd he faced no retribution. I doubt he thought he was gona win the golden ball, so he assumed he would have nothing to lose. Time for fifa to realise that sledging and racism is not directly the same things. Players will use anything to get at one another. I dont believe materazzi said anything about zidanes mum, and zidane said that he wasnt called a terrorist. So who knows what he even said. I dont agree with racism, such as crowds chanting names at players playing, but when it is undetectable, there is not much that can be done.
Just thought id add, a couple of post prior lord_pc said something about if another player had committed the act in the first game, nd went on to play the cup of his life would he deserve the golden ball. Ok i think your forgetting something here. quite simply if zidane had headbutted materazzi in the first game, or any other player for that matter, they wouldnt be playing again in the competition, thats how serious this is. De Rossi was rubbed out for 4 games with an elbow, and he wrote a letter of apology to fifa to ensure they didnt give him 5 games which they intended to do. This would have meant he would have been unavailable for the final. Therefore you argument is invalid. In fact, on your words, technically you could say you are saying he doesnt deserve the award at all.
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Ecoris
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 03:53 PM |
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Edited by Ecoris at 15:57, 14 Jul 2006.
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Sorry to say Ecoris, but this statement is far from being logic at all. I beat your younger brother in a small room where no other person is present. He runs to you and tells you what happened. You meet me right away in a hockey stadium watching a game and punch me right in the face while thousands of people look at us. So i am the good guy, and u r the bad guy?....
I think you miss my point Angelito. Your comparison is simply not valid. You leave out the most important aspect: Zidane was not just some arbitrary spectator at the stadium, he was one of the most important players in the game.
It is not just the fact that he did it at while many people were watching. The point is that he's a professional footballer taking part in the World Cup final. There are certain expectations and limits to what he can and what he can't do. He is not just a regular person, he's a representative for the game of football. By headbutting another player during the game he breaks that code of conduct and brings the game into disrepute.
Materazzi's action was no better. But this is where the big difference is found:
Everyone saw what Zidane did during the game.
Nobody heard what Materazzi said.
If we forget for one moment that they were both footballers during the incident and look upon them as private persons we cannot say that one was behaving better or worse than the other. But the point is that they were both footballers more than anything else at that time. Neither player's action can be justified in any way but Zidane's action was still worse than Materazzi's.
I am not trying to defend Materazzi, nobody is, but some people here are clearly defending Zidane if not showing sympathy towards his actions. Next thursday we may know what really happened when the hearing has taken place. I just had to react when several people expressed that they thought Materazzi's action was worse.
Concerning the golden ball:
Zidane got the most votes. Period. He played well after the group stage, and would have deserved had he not been sent off during the final.
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Cannavaro was part of a great team, so his performance wasnīt that obvious for everyone.
But Zidane was the guy who brought France into the final...no1 else. His power in the game vs Spain was just awesome. He scored vs Brazil, he scored vs Italy. The whole team was at least 1 step away from his performance (my point of view),
I think he won it because many votes were given before the end of the final, not bacause Cannavaro was overlooked.
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just similar to Oliver Kahn 2002. No other player of the german team 2002 was near that good. He brought them into the final. But he also got the reward after the final, even though his fault gave Brazil the lead...and even though Ronaldo scored awesome 8 goals.
I think Vieira was close to being just as important, especially during the earlier stages of the tournament. After all he scored the equalizer vs Spain.
Kahn was fantastic during the 2002 WC (except the final) and deserved to win the Golden Ball, but I think you forget Ballack. He scored the winning goals in the 1-0 wins vs USA and Korea in the quarter- and semi-finals.
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Lord_Pc
Promising
Famous Hero
Groin-Grabingly Clever
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posted July 14, 2006 04:15 PM |
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Just thought id add, a couple of post prior lord_pc said something about if another player had committed the act in the first game, nd went on to play the cup of his life would he deserve the golden ball. Ok i think your forgetting something here. quite simply if zidane had headbutted materazzi in the first game, or any other player for that matter, they wouldnt be playing again in the competition, thats how serious this is. De Rossi was rubbed out for 4 games with an elbow, and he wrote a letter of apology to fifa to ensure they didnt give him 5 games which they intended to do. This would have meant he would have been unavailable for the final. Therefore you argument is invalid. In fact, on your words, technically you could say you are saying he doesnt deserve the award at all.
i didnt mean a very bad act like a headbutt. i meant something that would have gotten the player sent off. like back chatting. then something like a wild tackle earning 2 yellows and then a red.
you could even reverse the situation and say that this player playes extremely well in every game scoring many goals and playing spectacularly. then in the final after scoring 2 goals, he goes and headbutts materazzi (or someone else). would he no longer be the best player???
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Da-da-dada-HEY-dada-da-da
Two goldfish were in their tank. One turns to the other and says, 'You man the guns, I'll drive.'
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 05:18 PM |
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i didnt mean a very bad act like a headbutt. i meant something that would have gotten the player sent off. like back chatting. then something like a wild tackle earning 2 yellows and then a red.
you could even reverse the situation and say that this player playes extremely well in every game scoring many goals and playing spectacularly. then in the final after scoring 2 goals, he goes and headbutts materazzi (or someone else). would he no longer be the best player???
not sure wot u mean, u mean reverse it so that its exactly the same as the incident we are arguing about?  If the incident isnt as bad as a headbutt, such as the many red cards we have seen throughout the tournament, or was a technical foul, then no, i dont think they should lose the prestigous award. However we arnt talking about zidane calling materazzi a silly person. We are talking about zidane ramming his bold head into the chest of materazzi. I use rammed to illustrate the ferocity of the attack, materazzi didnt even have time to defend himself. The incident itself is very serious. Thats why he should have his golden ball stripped from him and given to materazzi
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted July 14, 2006 07:03 PM |
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clearly, in my mind, Zidane deserves to be stripped of his golden ball award. Hes an absolute disgrace, more so because of the way hes gone about it afterwards. He is calling for materazzi to be punished for his words. That is one of the most unsportsmanlike acts he could perform. He is trying to protect his own ass by puttin the blame on someone else. Materazzi is not responsible for this incident. The blame falls heavily on Zidane. Sure materazzi might have said something, bt that doesnt mean anything in my book. Besides id believe materazzi over a dirty cheat like zidane anyday....
After reading this chapter, i think any further discussion is senseless, coz u obviously try to apply Materrazzi for the Nobel Peace Price, and prolly for the "Footballer of the century".
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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maretti
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted July 14, 2006 08:30 PM |
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I dont see the problem in a little trash talk, cause that is all it was. A player should be able to ignore it. Materrazzi doesnt deserve any punishment.
I like the fact that the more clever but not so talented player can trick the more stupid but very talented player. It brings hope to some of us. 
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Crag rules, Orrin and Ivor suck
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted July 14, 2006 08:56 PM |
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I think it depends on how far you go Maretti.
It dont make sense to strip Zidane of the golden ball reward.
It's already done.
Just like italy winning the championship.
If we want to go back & strip him of the golden ball then why not just go back & strip Italy of thoer championship.
Basically the same thang.
Cant go back & strip what you already gave.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 15, 2006 04:02 AM |
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After reading this chapter, i think any further discussion is senseless, coz u obviously try to apply Materrazzi for the Nobel Peace Price, and prolly for the "Footballer of the century".
I do not hide the fact that materazzi is my favourite player in the azzurri squad. However nor will i be biased against any his actions. I prefer materazzi over zidane, i may see things in a different light, but it doesnt mean i have lost the sense to be able to scrutinise the incident, and be able to critically analyse whose at fault. To be honest, nobody can argue a fair case for zidane claiming he is the innocent victim in all this. Im simply saying that I do not appreciate materazzi being blamed, especially by zidane himself, for something he may have instigated, but certainly didnt ask for.
The Golden Ball award goes to the best player of the tournament. How can a player who brings the game into disrepute win an award highlighting his riechous achievements for the cup. Utter blasphomy. I guess if Fifa doesnt act soon, then they cant take away his goal, just like maradonnas hand of god goal stil stands. However i believe if they act quickly, they can confidently say many of the voters who did indeed vote before the end of the game, would change their votes to cannavaro or someone else.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted July 15, 2006 04:48 AM |
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As far as I am concerned, Marco deserved what came to him.
After the game I would of waited for him at the parking lot. Screw materazzi, he needs his butt whipped.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 15, 2006 04:53 AM |
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haha materazzi isnt the smallest guy, lol myt just be me but isnt materazzi a foot taller then zidane 
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Lord_Pc
Promising
Famous Hero
Groin-Grabingly Clever
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posted July 15, 2006 04:54 AM |
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who does materazzi play for?
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Da-da-dada-HEY-dada-da-da
Two goldfish were in their tank. One turns to the other and says, 'You man the guns, I'll drive.'
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 15, 2006 05:08 AM |
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only the best team in the world, inter 
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted July 15, 2006 05:21 AM |
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haha materazzi isnt the smallest guy, lol myt just be me but isnt materazzi a foot taller then zidane
Is it just me or did the big tall Materazzi fall flat over a little head lol.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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DarkTitan
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted July 15, 2006 05:53 AM |
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haha im tryin to work out tho, i no zidane's headbutt was vicious and would have hurt, but was it enough to put him in the obvious agony he was in/faking? Altho id rather materazzi act weak and roll on floor in pain then get up nd break zidane's nose which he would have been more then capable of, and evening up the game.
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Aculias
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
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posted July 15, 2006 07:56 AM |
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That was no fake, you seen the look on his face, the dude dropped like a bag of potatos man.
The dude got knocked by a little man lol.
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Dreaming of a Better World
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