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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features This Popular Thread is 447 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 90 180 270 360 ... 443 444 445 446 447 · «PREV / NEXT»
FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted August 20, 2020 11:30 PM
Edited by FirePaladin at 23:31, 20 Aug 2020.

They're probably gonna have only 1/week growth even with Castle, tho, or have some kind of special building, like several Russian guys said.
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Phoenix4ever
Phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted August 20, 2020 11:36 PM

Well, let's hope so.

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Tordah
Tordah


Adventuring Hero
posted August 21, 2020 12:49 AM

Hourglass said:
Tordah said:

My typical strat for inferno is to rush Efreets first week with Castle, and try to dominate second week with them. But the strat is so ressource tight it's not working all the time. Even if i can make the dwelling happen i don't necessarily have the ressources to buy them day 1 week 2.


On your next game, give a chance to Calh and try upgrading the gogs on day 1. On avarage, you should have around 30 magogs to start with, and they're really good early game stack. I like to think that Magogs are probably the most buffed creature in Hota when compared to old Sod.

If you're willing to give imps a chance to redeem themselves, try starting with Ignatius and upgrade the imps on day 1. Turns out that a even weak creatures like that can dish some nice damage, if you're having a stack of over 100 of them.

I'm not trying to say that Inferno would be a good town, thou.


Actually the upgrade gog on day one was my original strategy with inferno (i used to play hotseat random with friends, so no one knew who started with which town) but it usually falls flat very early on because Calh levels to be ranged oriented but you only have a single range unit that falls flat as soon as week two. (Other than the balista hero, i think it's Pyre, still a horrible starting choice).

Even if it's the hero's speciality they don't really shine bright like let's say Ivor with upgraded elves or Valeska with upgraded crossbowmen. There is not a single inferno setup that has a chance of winning against these two regular starting strats.

The Imp hero is not too bad because you can get a ton of imp (familiars) early quickly, but the stack drains fast. if you keep the gog stack on top, second is the familiar pack with 3-7 filled with single imps, you rarely end up loosing none (early fights, mind you). Contrary to Tower where upgraded gremlins shoot (so they don't die), it's fairly weak in comparison.

Usually tower you lose nothing to early fights because you have a massive stack of rangers with a stack of stone golems, and although slow they tank more than enough. They tank more than hell hounds, too.

There is also not a single inferno starting strat that i have found that works against any tower hero starting with upgrading germlins. They may have lower damages then gogs/magogs but you can get a stack of a hundred day one, which is ridiculously strong.

The only town these starting strats can win early against is necropolis because walking undeads are abysmal. Even conflux without any upgrades work against gog/imp strat.

it's absolute lowest, absolute garbage, not to forget how fire magic is trash too.

there's an obvious case for a buff here and i really hope next HotA release will address this.

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted August 21, 2020 05:24 AM

FirePaladin said:
You've still got the option to choose and plenty of unit combinations and features in the faction. Also, imagine that they'll get only better with the upgrade, and even if they will be only 2/3 of the number of Gremlins, that'll still be a decent amount. Also, you don't let them be reached in the first place.

And they said the unupgraded bird will be offense oriented with slightly slower defensive stats, but that changes with the upgrade.

Also, it's not a Stronghold-like town, it's Ram Ranch in H3 with automatons and such.

Also, from the videos, you can estimate the stats of the other units, and the worms are pretty decent, as well as the other lower-tier troops.

The buffed robots will have around 60-80 damage per unit (or very high attack skill). Yes, I used H3 assist in order to estimate their damage value.


Well, ofc you won't just let the enemy to hit your halflings. Sometimes, it will just happen.

If you would get around 2/3 of of Halflings in total compared to gremlins, then their damage is actually very similiar to what gremlin stack is capable of doing now.

Also, I don't know if you did understand what I was talking about Stronghold.

Your argument is still mostly based on the demo, which literally says in the beginning that stuff may be changed. I'm afraid we're beating a dead horse.

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Mobosh
Mobosh

Tavern Dweller
posted August 22, 2020 07:53 PM

Hi!

I just started HotA and I find it hard to read the campaign intros before they scroll off the screen. can i read them somewhere else?
Right now I am thinking of taking screen shots and reading in paint
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DarkAtom
DarkAtom


Adventuring Hero
posted August 22, 2020 11:02 PM

Mobosh said:
Hi!

I just started HotA and I find it hard to read the campaign intros before they scroll off the screen. can i read them somewhere else?
Right now I am thinking of taking screen shots and reading in paint


I'm not sure if somebody has already done this already, but I have extracted the texts through hex editing and uploaded them here for u (and anybody else who might need them in the future). Enjoy!
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"If you get scared of doing what's right you might as well lay down and die" - Wulfstan, Heroes of Might and Magic V: Hammers of Fate

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Mobosh
Mobosh

Tavern Dweller
posted August 23, 2020 01:50 PM

DarkAtom said:

I'm not sure if somebody has already done this already, but I have extracted the texts through hex editing and uploaded them here for u (and anybody else who might need them in the future). Enjoy!


Hey, thats great! Thanks a lot! you should put it in the campaign section of the wiki so that its easy to find for people looking
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DarkAtom
DarkAtom


Adventuring Hero
posted August 23, 2020 03:25 PM

Mobosh said:
DarkAtom said:

I'm not sure if somebody has already done this already, but I have extracted the texts through hex editing and uploaded them here for u (and anybody else who might need them in the future). Enjoy!


Hey, thats great! Thanks a lot! you should put it in the campaign section of the wiki so that its easy to find for people looking


Which wiki are you talking about?
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"If you get scared of doing what's right you might as well lay down and die" - Wulfstan, Heroes of Might and Magic V: Hammers of Fate

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted August 23, 2020 04:40 PM

@DarkAtom

https://heroes.thelazy.net/
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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted August 29, 2020 01:38 PM

After the release of last "trailer", or whatever one is willing to call it, some new info has been discovered about Factory:

First of all, Docent confirmed that the starting skills we see on the hero aren't exactly right. So it is possible that the "pathfinding" we saw in the video indeed was somesort of placeholder.

Secondly, the stats on both upgraded tier 7 creatures can be seen in the trailer, if it's been watched frame by frame. (Credits about this discovery go to youtuber named Norovo, and the video can be seen here.)

Anyway, Juggernauts apparently have stats of

25 attack
30 defence
50-60 DMG
300 HP
8 speed

Crimson Couatl on the other hand seem to have

22 attack
22 defence
30-40 DMG
250 HP
15 speed

I would like to remind these aren't exactly "confirmed" as we're still wathching a trailer to showcase the creatures, so anything can still happen before the town comes out.

However, if we take these as the truth, Juggernauts will be creatures with great defence, pristine attack and HP, while being very slow on tier 7 standarts. On the other hand, I would call Crimson Couatls stats avarage, if not below-avarage, so the ability would need to carry them hard in order to turn these creatures good. It seems that the robo-branch will be rewarded with a fearsome, repairable supertank, but they can pretty give up any chances of having a speed advantage. The nature branch gets a speedy trickster, but not much other utility. Currently the robo-branch seems to be better overall, especially if the town has an additonal way of producing their tier 4's.

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syth
syth


Hired Hero
posted August 29, 2020 03:28 PM
Edited by syth at 15:30, 29 Aug 2020.

I hope they are adding new artifacts/changing skills in the next patch.

Slow/haste negator artifact:A minor backpack artifact(occupies one of the four slots on the left of the hero) that disables the effects of slow/haste for both parties would be fun.I mean we have a pendant that makes immune to forgetfullness which is a third level spell why not have one for the first level spells.It can open interesting strategies.

Artifact War machines:Some artifact versions of warmachnines like "Balista of the Lighting rod"(calls lighting strike with some chance for example) that does something more could be interesting.That way the warmachine skill could also be more usefull.A resurrecting first aid tent or blinding balista are some examples.You could place them in their respective slots.

Anti-ressurection: I wish there was spell in watermagic that does the ring of oblivion effect(At level 3 maybe) that negates resurrection and other raise dead effects.

Finally can zombies please be immune to slow.They are already slow but they always catch you in the movies .A mass not effecting zombies would be fun .They are already very bad anyway.

I am not that excited about the new town but the changes the new patch will bring actually.I don't know if it's possible but "warrior" AI could prioritize on key upgrades such as upgraded gremlins,gorgons,cerberus or vampire lords.So that it has a faster more solid expansion with less loss.Also AI could loose far less creatures while combating neutral armies.We play with AI a lot.It adds this unforseable aspect to our games,the wild card .

I get it they don't want to mess up the game but improving AI and providing counters to no brainer strategies should also add to PvP aspect of the game.

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted August 29, 2020 08:24 PM

Tordah said:
there's an obvious case for a buff here and i really hope next HotA release will address this.


But HotA already buffed magogs a lot; being able to aim their attacks means you can easily do 2-3 times as much damage as in vanilla when facing neutrals. That's a HUGE buff.

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Memo
Memo

Tavern Dweller
posted August 30, 2020 07:08 AM

syth said:
I hope they are adding new artifacts/changing skills in the next patch.

Slow/haste negator artifact:A minor backpack artifact(occupies one of the four slots on the left of the hero) that disables the effects of slow/haste for both parties would be fun.I mean we have a pendant that makes immune to forgetfullness which is a third level spell why not have one for the first level spells.It can open interesting strategies.

Artifact War machines:Some artifact versions of warmachnines like "Balista of the Lighting rod"(calls lighting strike with some chance for example) that does something more could be interesting.That way the warmachine skill could also be more usefull.A resurrecting first aid tent or blinding balista are some examples.You could place them in their respective slots.

Anti-ressurection: I wish there was spell in watermagic that does the ring of oblivion effect(At level 3 maybe) that negates resurrection and other raise dead effects.

Finally can zombies please be immune to slow.They are already slow but they always catch you in the movies .A mass not effecting zombies would be fun .They are already very bad anyway.

I am not that excited about the new town but the changes the new patch will bring actually.I don't know if it's possible but "warrior" AI could prioritize on key upgrades such as upgraded gremlins,gorgons,cerberus or vampire lords.So that it has a faster more solid expansion with less loss.Also AI could loose far less creatures while combating neutral armies.We play with AI a lot.It adds this unforseable aspect to our games,the wild card .

I get it they don't want to mess up the game but improving AI and providing counters to no brainer strategies should also add to PvP aspect of the game.


Docent Picolan recently said that there will be no new artifacts and skill fixes in 1.7. Only the city itself and the campaign. Skill changes are planned for the next major update, but when it will be is unknown.
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FlavaClavius
FlavaClavius

Tavern Dweller
posted August 30, 2020 10:00 AM

Can AI opponents see what artifacts you have?

So playing a hot seat HotA game, a semi powerful opponent attacked; he cast berserk once early in the fight and my playing partner won the battle fairly easily, but we loaded from the auto save, and equipped the Pendant of Dispassion for the berserk immunity, for the reload.  This was the only change made, however this time the computer opponent went in another direction and didnít attack.  We reloaded, removing the Pendant and the AI attacked as he did the first time.  Does the AI have knowledge of the artifacts you equipped and is that information used in determining its moves?
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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted August 30, 2020 02:03 PM

FlavaClavius said:
So playing a hot seat HotA game, a semi powerful opponent attacked; he cast berserk once early in the fight and my playing partner won the battle fairly easily, but we loaded from the auto save, and equipped the Pendant of Dispassion for the berserk immunity, for the reload.  This was the only change made, however this time the computer opponent went in another direction and didnít attack.  We reloaded, removing the Pendant and the AI attacked as he did the first time.  Does the AI have knowledge of the artifacts you equipped and is that information used in determining its moves?


To my knowledge, yes it does. It also knows the spells you're having in your spellbook, and atleast partly uses this information to play around AOE spells like meteor shower.

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syth
syth


Hired Hero
posted August 30, 2020 06:00 PM

Memo said:
syth said:
I hope they are adding new artifacts/changing skills in the next patch.

Slow/haste negator artifact:A minor backpack artifact(occupies one of the four slots on the left of the hero) that disables the effects of slow/haste for both parties would be fun.I mean we have a pendant that makes immune to forgetfullness which is a third level spell why not have one for the first level spells.It can open interesting strategies.

-----.


Docent Picolan recently said that there will be no new artifacts and skill fixes in 1.7. Only the city itself and the campaign. Skill changes are planned for the next major update, but when it will be is unknown.


Thanks.I didn't hear that.Shame I was looking forward for a balance patch.Ohh well they can take it for that next major update then.We can always hope for a little suprise also .

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted August 31, 2020 06:44 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 18:46, 31 Aug 2020.

Not really sure if I'm looking forward to more nerfs. HotA team is certainly very capable, but they did some things I don't really agree with, like overnerfing Diplomacy to crap tier. I'm also not overly happy with nerfs to logistics, making the game even slower and (indirectly) buffing town portal, Castle and DD even more.

Also, why the kooky 5/10/20% distribution? What's wrong with 7/14/21%?

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted August 31, 2020 09:04 PM
Edited by Hourglass at 05:08, 01 Sep 2020.

Doomforge said:
Not really sure if I'm looking forward to more nerfs. HotA team is certainly very capable, but they did some things I don't really agree with, like overnerfing Diplomacy to crap tier. I'm also not overly happy with nerfs to logistics, making the game even slower and (indirectly) buffing town portal, Castle and DD even more.

Also, why the kooky 5/10/20% distribution? What's wrong with 7/14/21%?


Do you know the "join only for money" option can be turned off in both editors? I've actually seen only few complaints about the diplo change because of that. For example, a template such as Clash of Dragons can still be played in the same way as always, under classic diplomacy rules.

And about nerfs, I'm not expecting them to make more of them, since a while ago Docent listed bunch of "problematic" secondary skills. All the mentioned ones were among the worst in the game, so there will likely be some buffs instead.

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Tordah
Tordah


Adventuring Hero
posted September 01, 2020 08:57 PM

Doomforge said:
Tordah said:
there's an obvious case for a buff here and i really hope next HotA release will address this.


But HotA already buffed magogs a lot; being able to aim their attacks means you can easily do 2-3 times as much damage as in vanilla when facing neutrals. That's a HUGE buff.


You could say the same for liches, but liches actually do damages contrary to magogs lmao

it's not that big of a buff.

I found an insane strat using interno, where i upgraded hell hounds fast for cerberuses and my secondary heroes have 1 instead of imp, so they move fast. my main only has sultan effrets and archdevils, also to move very fast. add in the castle gates (only in maps with multiple infernos available on the map) and some good movement artifacts and you can get ahead in lenghty games because all your characters move about 1.5 times per day what the CPU moves (because the CPU doesn't consider its army speed it seems).

i played a single scenario and ended up playing this way because i realized the main only with tier 6 and 7 can stomp any enemy heroes easily (especially Acxis with mysticism mastery and some good magic) and i can gather all my units in a single castle and chain them to him when i need the whole army.

but you know, let's say i siege a castle with all stacks i end up loosing a lot of troops while if i siege a castle only with arch devils and sultan effrets i end up loosing a few, but because these are rare i'd rather lose a lot of low-tier units.

i still hold the case that fire magic is drastically underpowered, and that even if i found a use for cerberus (high speed speeds up mules heroes), the rest are drastically abysmal. imps/fam are worthless compared to all other tier1, magogs are crap compared to let's say upgraded crossbowmen, demon are worthless compared to crusaders/paladins or basilisks or most other tier4, and pit lords other than their respawn cannot compete with other tier5 such as genies and gorgons.

only the sultan effrets are beyond good (they are better than some tier7 imo) and the arch devils are competitive tier7 units while not being the best they have a lot of uses.

also last thing, most heroes are horrible and have bad/slow starts. Acxis is ok, Zydar is good late game (sorcery mastery stacks very high late game), and Pyre has an ok start because logistic + balista, best might hero imo. mid game if you boost Rashka you can get a very decent hero too.

also most start with crap skills like scouting and scholar which is a huge dealbreaker for most tbh.

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted September 01, 2020 10:37 PM

Tordah said:


You could say the same for liches, but liches actually do damages contrary to magogs lmao

it's not that big of a buff.


It is a very good buff actually.

I, and probably most other players didn't even bother to upgrade magogs back in SOD, since they could probably only shoot in the beginning of the battle, if you wouldn't want to target your own units as well. And even then, it was unlikely to use the AOE damage as your advantage. Now you don't really need to worry about shooting your own creatures, and it's far easier to target multiple stacks at once. Magogs are probably 4th or 5th best creatures in their tier, depending how one is willing to rate harpy hags. So, they're avarage or slighly better than that, but there are fights they're clearly better than Marksman, for example.

You're right that Inferno is a bad town, likely the worst one actually, but they're better than that sounds tbh. One thing I would like adress is that I've seen couple of times now that people seem to strongly connect Fire magic to Inferno as well, but that's pretty much only true lorewise, as gameplaywise Fire magic doesn't really offer much to Inferno - yes, efreets are immune the armageddon, but that's really it. Inferno heroes have only slightly increased chances of learning fire magic, so fire magic's "badness" isn't really connected to the town itself and slight buffs to fire magic wouldn't make much difference for Inferno.

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