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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions This Popular Thread is 149 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 30 60 90 120 ... 145 146 147 148 149 · «PREV / NEXT»
Phoenix4ever
Phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 07, 2020 09:30 AM

bloodsucker said:

So I want to understand how you deliberately handy cap yourself, before stating once again that your gameplay sucks.
Did you got the motivation behind my questioning?


The only way I see I'm handicapping myself is by maining all heroes and not always the best heroes and then the Town Portal nerf, which I did to make the game more challenging and fun.

Yes my map is an XL +underground map with lots of big and small islands and caves and plenty of water. Originally based on the Armageddon's Blade map Thousand Islands, but that would be impossible to tell by now.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted June 07, 2020 12:52 PM

I know that map... And those (and DD) are the handy caps I was aware of but if you arm both Kyrre and Astral, Kyrre will soon surpass Astral. And then you have to persist in betting on the wrong horse to maintain the same leading hero. Plus, obviously you don't chain armies as much as you could or best hero would vary more often.
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Hotboi21
Hotboi21

Tavern Dweller
posted June 07, 2020 04:08 PM

My few personal ideas for next updates since it become excellect mod for pvp tournaments and more fun to play than origin version:
1. magic guild rebalance like other guys says: implosion goes to fire magic, town portal all schools like magic arrow, resurrection to water ( hota crew could make some story plot that alamar and jeddite will become cleric and replace useless 2 heroes from castle with them then add 2 new warlocks for example sorrow and quicksand mains or alternative of grindan with slow). This will force players to play situational styles.
2. My idea of nerf for necro since players can pay even 6-8k just to play this town. First of all we need to slow them with stacking and farming skeletons cuz their power stack is too strong, my example is to change necromancy into something like in h4. After won battle instead of getting for example 25 skeletons hero will get 2 wights, 3 walking dead and 6 skeletons. We will be thinking then about deleting walking dead often cuz they will slow down hero with movement so we will need more helping heroes with army transfer and our powerstack will be a lot weaker since it will split on 3 different units where zombies and wights are useful only for meat most of time. Nerf also skeleton transformer for 50% effectiveness for example transform 100 units into 50 skeletons. If this will be not enough I suggest nerf movement speed of skeleton -1.
3. Magic University of conflux - this is also huge unbalanced building. When you find conflux in early game you always build fast magic university to train all control heroes with earth and air magic so easy. My idea is to change build path something like magic guild lvl 5 needed or magic elemental bulding or replace this building for example boost of more elementals to buy in next week +1/2. Maybe Idea is to add elemental altar on maps where you can get 1 specific magic school and its guarded by elementals or just strong monsters.
4. More creature banks: Kill stacks of High elves to get few sharpshooters, devil  bank similiar to griffin cons but with cerbers, monk monastery bank (kill some monks - get swordman or monks) similar ideas to gorgons and pit fiend(more possible of demon stacking since inferno is overall weak).
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Oddball13579
Oddball13579


Legendary Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
posted June 08, 2020 04:12 AM

Okay so Interference, aside from Navigators and Battle Mages which are the only magic class that can learn it normally I am assuming, no other magic class can learn it via levelling up?

The wiki says "In Horn of the Abyss, Resistance since v.1.6.0 is banned by default, and all heroes that would start with Resistance start with Interference, aside from Thorgrim, who is also banned by default." So then this means that Resistance is banned on all maps and is completely replaced by Interference?
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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted June 08, 2020 10:57 AM

Yes, as a starting skill. But if Resistance was enabled before in that map, I expect it to still be an option for a skill.
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Aciel
Aciel

Tavern Dweller
posted June 08, 2020 06:51 PM

Hotboi21 said:
My few personal ideas for next updates since it become excellect mod for pvp tournaments and more fun to play than origin version:
1. magic guild rebalance like other guys says: implosion goes to fire magic, town portal all schools like magic arrow, resurrection to water ( hota crew could make some story plot that alamar and jeddite will become cleric and replace useless 2 heroes from castle with them then add 2 new warlocks for example sorrow and quicksand mains or alternative of grindan with slow). This will force players to play situational styles.
2. My idea of nerf for necro since players can pay even 6-8k just to play this town. First of all we need to slow them with stacking and farming skeletons cuz their power stack is too strong, my example is to change necromancy into something like in h4. After won battle instead of getting for example 25 skeletons hero will get 2 wights, 3 walking dead and 6 skeletons. We will be thinking then about deleting walking dead often cuz they will slow down hero with movement so we will need more helping heroes with army transfer and our powerstack will be a lot weaker since it will split on 3 different units where zombies and wights are useful only for meat most of time. Nerf also skeleton transformer for 50% effectiveness for example transform 100 units into 50 skeletons. If this will be not enough I suggest nerf movement speed of skeleton -1.
3. Magic University of conflux - this is also huge unbalanced building. When you find conflux in early game you always build fast magic university to train all control heroes with earth and air magic so easy. My idea is to change build path something like magic guild lvl 5 needed or magic elemental bulding or replace this building for example boost of more elementals to buy in next week +1/2. Maybe Idea is to add elemental altar on maps where you can get 1 specific magic school and its guarded by elementals or just strong monsters.
4. More creature banks: Kill stacks of High elves to get few sharpshooters, devil  bank similiar to griffin cons but with cerbers, monk monastery bank (kill some monks - get swordman or monks) similar ideas to gorgons and pit fiend(more possible of demon stacking since inferno is overall weak).


1. Yeah, magic needs rebalancing the most out of all skills. I've already wrote about this.
2. Necro is one of the strongest towns, that for sure. I wouldn't go for something as drastic as this though and HOTA team already nerfed Necromancy Skill. -1 speed on skeleton warriors would be good enough nerf in my opinion, since for pro players unit speed is one of the most important stats and skeleton warrior with 4 speed would have trouble in Griffin Conservatory, even with Galthram. Maybe lowering Skeleton defense stat or HP by 1 would be necessary, but only maybe. One other change I would propose is making the skeleton producing building more expensive (i think it is called Skeleton Converter in English).
3. LOl, I agree that Magic University is unbalanced, but I'd actually make it cheaper. It stops you from getting upgraded pixies, and if magic were to be rebalanced, the worth of MU would diminish anyway.
4. That is a very good idea. A building that's opposite of Griffin Conservatory, you fight cerbers and get Devils? I like that a lot.

About monster banks, my ideal solution would be for every terrain to spawn Pickets and Hives, but the last building that gives you 7-lv units should be different. Grass and Rough terrains would give Angel monster bank, Swamp Sea Serpents (Pirate Cave would have to spawn on swamp, and yeah, I know that it would be easier than other banks, but Fortress and Cove aren't strong towns, so  it would work out and Sea serpents are not that strong anyway), Snow would give Titans (I know it's an overkill, but Giants are much weaker than Angels, and Tower is a weak town, even with HOTA team adding djinn lamps; maybe it could go like this: 1Giant/1Titan/2Titans/3 Titans for respective monster bank size) Inferno/Dung/Necro would get a new Devil monster bank. Sand would get Firebirds.
Additionaly, Rampart could get Sharpshooters monster bank instead of Cyclops and Tower could get Enchanters.
The advantage of my proposal is that it would make the game more diverse and interesting. Right now, 80-90% of players army in Multiplayer games are Wiverns/cyclops/Angels, with Giants acting like a cannon fodder for stronger guards sometimes, and I would like to see some change.
The drawback is that it would probably require some rebalancing of towns later, but it's not a fatal flaw since HOTA introduced licitation system and stronger units monster banks could just have a higher value.      
 

I know that my last proposition is a long stretch, so it's more of a food for thought. I also know that HOTA team is probably very busy with creating a new town, so getting skills rebalanced and a Factory town would already be very impressive.  


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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted June 08, 2020 07:42 PM
Edited by Hourglass at 19:42, 08 Jun 2020.

Aciel said:

2. Necro is one of the strongest towns, that for sure. I wouldn't go for something as drastic as this though and HOTA team already nerfed Necromancy Skill. -1 speed on skeleton warriors would be good enough nerf in my opinion, since for pro players unit speed is one of the most important stats and skeleton warrior with 4 speed would have trouble in Griffin Conservatory, even with Galthram. Maybe lowering Skeleton defense stat or HP by 1 would be necessary, but only maybe. One other change I would propose is making the skeleton producing building more expensive (i think it is called Skeleton Converter in English).


Skeleton speed nerf is out of the question, Hota will likely not ever change the original stats of the creatures. Steel golems were made solely so they wouldn't need to buff gold golems by giving them +1 speed. Especially when the Warriors have only +1 speed compared to original skeletons. In Homm3 upgrades always give speed. Change like that would be very unnatural to the game.  

Nerfing necro could be done simply by:
1) Banning Galthran, as he is already banned elsewhere.
2) Skeleton transformer requires Unheard graves to be build, not the other way around.

Aciel said:

4. That is a very good idea. A building that's opposite of Griffin Conservatory, you fight cerbers and get Devils? I like that a lot.



I also like this idea alot, Inferno definetly needs help.

Aciel said:

About monster banks, my ideal solution would be for every terrain to spawn Pickets and Hives, but the last building that gives you 7-lv units should be different. Grass and Rough terrains would give Angel monster bank, Swamp Sea Serpents (Pirate Cave would have to spawn on swamp, and yeah, I know that it would be easier than other banks, but Fortress and Cove aren't strong towns, so  it would work out and Sea serpents are not that strong anyway), Snow would give Titans (I know it's an overkill, but Giants are much weaker than Angels, and Tower is a weak town, even with HOTA team adding djinn lamps; maybe it could go like this: 1Giant/1Titan/2Titans/3 Titans for respective monster bank size) Inferno/Dung/Necro would get a new Devil monster bank. Sand would get Firebirds.
Additionaly, Rampart could get Sharpshooters monster bank instead of Cyclops and Tower could get Enchanters.
The advantage of my proposal is that it would make the game more diverse and interesting. Right now, 80-90% of players army in Multiplayer games are Wiverns/cyclops/Angels, with Giants acting like a cannon fodder for stronger guards sometimes, and I would like to see some change.


It wouldn't be very big difference, thou. Instead of the former X, players would get the new Y instead. The armies would still be very repeating.

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Aciel
Aciel

Tavern Dweller
posted June 08, 2020 10:46 PM


Hourglass said:
It wouldn't be very big difference, thou. Instead of the former X, players would get the new Y instead. The armies would still be very repeating.



Hmmm... The very best thing would be if every town would have it's own special banks, but that would be too much work.

Next best solution would probably be to set 3 monster banks for every terrain: a 6lv creature, a 7lv creature and a strong shooter (the equivalents of Wiverns, Angels and Cyclops). Castle, Rampart and Elementals would have one monster bank set, Inferno/Dung/Necro another, then Cove/Fortress and finally Tower/Stronghold/Factory could also be another set to make things easier. We would need 12 different monster banks + extra monster bank for Sand terrain (best would be firebirds). If I'm not wrong, the game already has 7 (Angels, Cyclops, Wiverns, Giants, Firebirds, Enchanters and Sea Serpents if Pirate Cave would become mainstream). That would leave 6.

Putting Tower and Stronghold together seems most likely lore-wise, since it's possible that Yog has stolen some golems when fleeting Bracada and later these golems had freed themselves and started producing Giants/Titams in their experimental shops. Besides, these countries are neighbours, so migration of small factions is very possible. Factory will be a technological faction so they would also be interested in stealing tech from wizards and other nations.


My proposition for creatures from new banks: Devils, Sharpshooters, Unicorns, Psychic Elementals, 6th level Factory unit(shooting type), Manticores

Proposition for guards: Cerbers, High Elves, Pegasi, Storm Elementals, some Factory unit, Harpy Hags  

7th level: Angels/giants or titans/ sea serpents, devils

Shooter: cyclops/enchanters/sharpshooters/6th level Factory unit,

6th level: Wiverns, manticores, unicorns, psychic elementals


My proposition for how to distribute this stuff:

Castle/Rampart/Elementals: Angels, Sharpshooters, Unicorns
Snow/Wasteland/Rough: Giants or Titans/ Cyclops/ Psychic elementals
Inferno/Dung/Necro: Devils, 6lv Factory unit, Manticores
Fortress/Cove: Sea Serpents, Enchanters, Wiverns

Sand: Firebirds and maybe something in future (some unique units like Fairy Dragons or Nomads for movement would be cool). Pyramid could become a monster bank building.


I wouldn't mind even if Hota team just recolored and renamed some of the existing monster banks to create more of them.  


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Hotboi21
Hotboi21

Tavern Dweller
posted June 09, 2020 12:42 AM

Wow thats much better idea that I suggested with banks, seems like dream idea. Armies will be not the same like angel/wyvern/cyclops and will more depend on map terrains and banks dedicated to them. About necro agreed if we nerf skeleton speed and maybe 1hp less this town will be finally semi-good not ultra op no matter what biom with guaranted op stack.
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Oddball13579
Oddball13579


Legendary Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
posted June 09, 2020 08:02 PM
Edited by Oddball13579 at 20:04, 09 Jun 2020.

FirePaladin said:
Yes, as a starting skill. But if Resistance was enabled before in that map, I expect it to still be an option for a skill.
Huh interesting.

I did some poking around in the map editor and it seems that Interference is also disabled/banned as well. To be learned I mean. So that only heroes that start with it can have it and it can't be learned.

Can't say that I am a big fan of that. Interference should be a Might hero only ability. And Resistance should be a Magic hero only ability. Why ban Resistance completely? And then have Interference banned as well? I am confusion.

I really don't want to have to go through all the maps and enable Resistance manually.
____________
"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
"I would have needed to dislocate my jaw to fit it inside my hole." - Blizzardboy

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Mighty_Jeddite
Mighty_Jeddite

Tavern Dweller
Using Armageddon...
posted June 11, 2020 07:36 PM
Edited by Mighty_Jeddite at 19:41, 11 Jun 2020.

I just want to first of all day that I love HoTA, it adds so many amazing things, and my only suggestion is potentially too much. Secondly this is my first time actually posting anything on the internet in a chat thing forum whatever like this, so I have no clue what I'm doing and this may be garbage. Also I'm doing this on mobile so I have marginally less control of any I'm doing.

With all that out of the way I want to propose some sort of building where you can permanently fuse a combination artifact. This would be expensive, I imagine it at the price of the artifacts from the merchant, so more for one like the Power of the Dragon Father, than The Wizards Well.

Also if this is too much, then you could also nerf the artifact, but the goal is too open more inventory slots, but at an incredible price.

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Oddball13579
Oddball13579


Legendary Hero
Grandmaster of the Hunt
posted June 11, 2020 08:24 PM

Mighty_Jeddite said:
this is my first time actually posting anything on the internet in a chat thing forum whatever like this, so I have no clue what I'm doing and this may be garbage. Also I'm doing this on mobile so I have marginally less control of any I'm doing.
Welcome!!!

Mighty_Jeddite said:
With all that out of the way I want to propose some sort of building where you can permanently fuse a combination artifact. This would be expensive, I imagine it at the price of the artifacts from the merchant, so more for one like the Power of the Dragon Father, than The Wizards Well.

Also if this is too much, then you could also nerf the artifact, but the goal is too open more inventory slots, but at an incredible price.
Artifacts are permanently fused unless you decide to dismantle them. So a permanently fuse option would be somewhat redundant.

As for the freeing of equipment slots, I think you are missing the point of combination artifacts. There's no reason for you to have to free up slots to add more artifacts onto your hero. You still get the effects of all the component artifacts plus the effect of the combined artifact.

For instance, Angelic Alliance gives a +21 to all primary stats (component effect) as well as allowing good and neutral faction's creatures to be mixed without a morale penalty and casts expert prayer at the beginning of combat (artifact effect).

If you were to free up the component slots not only would that allow you to equip even more artifacts, it could potentially allow you to equip multiple combination artifacts. You could have the Angelic Alliance and Power of the Dragon Father equipped at the same time. Which would give you a +37 to all primary stats. (+21 from Angelic Alliance, +16 from Power of the Dragon Father).

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"Just slide her down a bit farther. I could wear her like a hat." - Gnomes
"I would have needed to dislocate my jaw to fit it inside my hole." - Blizzardboy

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Mighty_Jeddite
Mighty_Jeddite

Tavern Dweller
Using Armageddon...
posted June 11, 2020 09:04 PM

Oddball13579 said:
If you were to free up the component slots not only would that allow you to equip even more artifacts, it could potentially allow you to equip multiple combination artifacts. You could have the Angelic Alliance and Power of the Dragon Father equipped at the same time. Which would give you a +37 to all primary stats. (+21 from Angelic Alliance, +16 from Power of the Dragon Father).



Yes, that is the general idea, I kind of imagined it being mainly used extremely late game, or a custom map, because on these giant maps you tend to get a lot of stuff, so when I have like eight heros with combinations, and I hate using more than one hero at all. So I want my main dude to be able to use some of them in combination one one dude, sure he can't be everywhere at once, but with only phoenixes I can move about the map real quick. Anyways off topic, admittedly it is very over powered, but yeah...

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted June 12, 2020 12:01 AM

What do you think about Cloud layer for maps? Or Space layer? And as usual, these can be used as just a continuation of either surface  or underground.
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NoobX
NoobX


Promising
Legendary Hero
Now, this is a paradox...
posted June 12, 2020 12:36 AM

Fred had a good idea with his floating islands, but a whole new layer is just way too complicated and not worth the time.  The map sizes are growing and they are already hard to fill; now imagine having a new layer which should come with its own unique objects to simulate a floating world.  Also, it is simple to visualize the underground with the rock terrain, it's edges acting as cave walls, but how would you symbolize air/space?  You would need a new terrain that would have to not only make the terrain look like it's floating, but would also have to convey that there is an overworld below it.
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Ghost said:
Door knob resembles anus tap.

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted June 12, 2020 12:40 AM

Well, Underground layer is in fact just a simple bonus layer, that has "Rock" terrain all over instead of water. However, I asked this question because someone reminded me of it, and I am just curious to hear what you all think.
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NoobX
NoobX


Promising
Legendary Hero
Now, this is a paradox...
posted June 12, 2020 12:50 AM

Yes, but you already have what you need to make the underground layer serve it's intended purpose.  When you say "Air layer", you kind of need something that would make it a real air layer, not just overworld 2.0.
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Ghost said:
Door knob resembles anus tap.

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Mighty_Jeddite
Mighty_Jeddite

Tavern Dweller
Using Armageddon...
posted June 12, 2020 02:50 AM

FirePaladin said:
Well, Underground layer is in fact just a simple bonus layer, that has "Rock" terrain all over instead of water. However, I asked this question because someone reminded me of it, and I am just curious to hear what you all think.


With this in mind... Could you simply make another underground layer?
You could switch the Overworld/Underworld toggle into a multi-toggle cycle thing. Also you could add the ability to possibly right click to show all layers. As a side note, I am not a game designer, but I have enough coding experience to have a clue what I am talking about. Another factor of this, would be potentially having to add several new transportation features in between layers, or at least recoding the way existing ones function.
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Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. -Albert Einstein

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Aciel
Aciel

Tavern Dweller
posted June 12, 2020 06:50 PM

About the FirePaladin idea to add more layers, I think it's cool but probably will never happen because it's too much work.

I have also been thinking about Clouds or Floating Islands layer and I'm sure many other players did too. I think it could be easily implemented by simply having it instead of underground, so just showing it wouldn't be a problem.

What would be hard though, is creating new buildings and terrain. I have read somewhere that one of hota creators spend 100+ hours creating new Wasteland terrain. It takes a long time, because you need to design many similar but different tiles and other details.

Therefore, although a good idea, it would be too time consuming.
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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Supreme Hero
Undercover modder
posted June 12, 2020 09:44 PM

@Aciel

It wasn't my idea to begin with.

I think a secondary layer for anything like an underground or another surface could work (in case the map author needs it).
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