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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions This Popular Thread is 165 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 30 60 90 120 150 ... 161 162 163 164 165 · «PREV / NEXT»
Phoenix4ever
Phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted February 10, 2021 08:03 AM

I don't think they would use the cannon again, but maybe Ammo Cart yeah or a brand new one.

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weilan
weilan


Adventuring Hero
posted February 10, 2021 11:29 AM

The_Green_Drag said:
Do we know which War machine(s) the Factory town is gonna have?

I'm curious cause I feel like it would be ammo cart cause of the guns, which I'd imagine don't have many total shots. But with the cannon now being a thing, would that make more sense? Maybe access to both since it's suppose to be a stronger town anyways?


Canon is something related to the pirate theme of Cove, I don't think it fits a western theme town.

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The_Green_Drag
The_Green_Drag


Supreme Hero
posted February 10, 2021 03:49 PM

I know the canon is supposed to be coveís thing, but with it becoming canon (pun intended) in the lore, at least for hota, wouldnít it make sense for them to have cannons somewhere? Itíll be a nice touch if they cover this little detail in the campaign, but Iíd like to think if they can figure out flame throwers and lasers, they can get a cannon working

I wouldnít expect them to have a hero who specializes in the canon, but maybe an expensive upgrade to their blacksmith will be a cannon workshop.

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FirePaladin
FirePaladin


Legendary Hero
Undorcover modder
posted February 10, 2021 05:07 PM

I think the cannons are to be used in the siege, either with Grail built or not.
____________
"Goblins use pistols because a shotgun recoil would kick them off the ground flying."

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LordInsane
LordInsane


Adventuring Hero
posted February 10, 2021 05:27 PM

We actually already know that the Factory campaign will venture somewhere in the rough vicinity of where cannons have seen use by non-pirates in NWC lore - the Tarred and Feathered teaser was stated to take place on islands off the coast of Jadame, something the environment in the cutscene correlates with, and on those island (on the Dagger Wound Islands, to be precise) lies the town of Blood Drop, where a cannon can be found in Might & Magic VIII.

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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted February 10, 2021 05:37 PM

IMO it's either Cannon or something completely new. We already know that sieges will use cannons, Cove pirates and Factory cowboys are somehow related, and in general it's pretty hard to imagine the tech town having some sort of old school war machine. Lastly, the "ballista-tent-cart-cycle" was already fulfilled by NWC back in the day.

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zilkin
zilkin

Tavern Dweller
posted February 10, 2021 06:01 PM

Simultaneous turns

I love simultaneous turns, and when they get interupted they can be brought back by saving and loading the game again. I think it would be nice if there was a buton or option in game to turn them on.
But best option I think would be to have simultaneous turns entire game on.
I dont know if that would be hard to code or not.
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weilan
weilan


Adventuring Hero
posted February 10, 2021 06:16 PM

Hourglass said:
IMO it's either Cannon or something completely new. We already know that sieges will use cannons, Cove pirates and Factory cowboys are somehow related, and in general it's pretty hard to imagine the tech town having some sort of old school war machine. Lastly, the "ballista-tent-cart-cycle" was already fulfilled by NWC back in the day.


The only relation I see is in real life between Pirates in the Caribbean Sea and the Wild West/Frontier taking place during roughly the same time periods.

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The_Green_Drag
The_Green_Drag


Supreme Hero
posted February 10, 2021 06:27 PM

Hourglass said:
IMO it's either Cannon or something completely new.


Thatís kinda my view on it. But imo it lessens the quality a bit if both new factions have their own unique war machine. Thatís why I think ammo cart + cannon after an extra investment is a good compromise cause it fits the theme, and doesnít add a fifth war machine.

Only other option maybe is if they have no typical blacksmith war machine
Since we know mechanics will likely be healing mechanical units they sorta have a heating tent already.


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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted February 10, 2021 07:13 PM

weilan said:

The only relation I see is in real life between Pirates in the Caribbean Sea and the Wild West/Frontier taking place during roughly the same time periods.


I understand what you mean, but I remember Docent once talked there was a connection between Cove and Factory. I don't know if there should be a connection in terms of traditional MM universe, or if it's just their own storytelling.

The_Green_Drag said:

Thatís kinda my view on it. But imo it lessens the quality a bit if both new factions have their own unique war machine. Thatís why I think ammo cart + cannon after an extra investment is a good compromise cause it fits the theme, and doesnít add a fifth war machine.


I personally would rule out the possibility of an old war machine. This is because in SoD, there's already a perfect "cycle" of war machines (3 machines distributed equally by 9 towns) , and as Cove didn't break the cycle, it makes even less sense to do it now. Additionally, as it currently stands, only Stronghold is capable of building 2 different war machines, and I don't think they're willing to take that uniqueness away from them.

The_Green_Drag said:

Since we know mechanics will likely be healing mechanical units they sorta have a heating tent already.



True, but I actually think it would be quite clever by them, if they would come up with a new "first aid tent" - a warmachine that would replace the tent, just like cannon can replace the ballista. And the new machine could be controlled and developed by first aid skill, perhaps simply by changing the current skill (or simply banning the old one and replacing it)

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The_Green_Drag
The_Green_Drag


Supreme Hero
posted February 10, 2021 10:03 PM

Hmmmm I wonder if they might have their own now that I think about it......And it'll be used to power up a troop. Maybe that's how you activate things like charging the juggernaut's laser attack, allowing a mechanic to heal, and maybe something with the 4th tier as well.

Then there also isn't a second new war machine added that anybody can pick up and use.  

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Romanov77
Romanov77


Known Hero
posted February 10, 2021 11:27 PM

I have a question about the Neutral Dwellings creature accumulation.I know this doesn't really upset multiplayer, as I know that basically all the current multiplayer meta is clearing banks and getting wyverns and angels.

I was wondering,at least in single player gaming, isn't this a HUGE change that completely alters the game's balance?

I read that even when they stay neutral, they accumulate 1 creature per week. Does this means that finding a unclaimed Dragon Cave during late game is basically hitting jackpot as it will have dozens of Dragons ready to be hired?

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VMaiko
VMaiko


Known Hero
posted February 11, 2021 03:40 AM

Romanov77 said:
I have a question about the Neutral Dwellings creature accumulation.I know this doesn't really upset multiplayer, as I know that basically all the current multiplayer meta is clearing banks and getting wyverns and angels.

I was wondering,at least in single player gaming, isn't this a HUGE change that completely alters the game's balance?

I read that even when they stay neutral, they accumulate 1 creature per week. Does this means that finding a unclaimed Dragon Cave during late game is basically hitting jackpot as it will have dozens of Dragons ready to be hired?


If you propose, an idea taken from ERA is that the guards could also be accumulated to make it more balanced. But I don't think they will do something like that, talking about balance sheets in an expansion as closed and full of prejudices as HotA for breaking the versatility of what we were used to in SoD in the old school, is not a good idea at all.

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Do you want a clear, fair, faithful and orderly game? Play HotA, but don't overdrive your balance ideas for your own interests because you guys are ruining the game yourself. It's a shame because HotA has no options to choose options like WoG had, otherwise no one would be with all this mess.

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LordInsane
LordInsane


Adventuring Hero
posted February 11, 2021 03:55 AM

Hourglass said:
I understand what you mean, but I remember Docent once talked there was a connection between Cove and Factory. I don't know if there should be a connection in terms of traditional MM universe, or if it's just their own storytelling.

If nothing else, there's at least one connection from the intersection of the traditional MM universe and the storytelling of their campaigns - location. We know the Factory campaign will involve going into areas fairly close to the Cove's homeland (Regna) that either recently was invaded or will soon be invaded by the Regnans (it depends on when the Factory campaign takes place relative to MM8), and that the Factory will settle down in an area the Regnans have been known to seek alliances in.

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sd0
sd0

Tavern Dweller
posted February 11, 2021 03:13 PM
Edited by sd0 at 16:53, 11 Feb 2021.

Hello,
first of all I would like thank to everyone who participate/d in the HOTA development and I am very grateful that some people are trying to balance out and improve HOMAM 3 gameplay.

After playing the HOTA for some time, I came up with some ideas of improvement that can or can not make sense so I am posting them here so the community can give me some feedback. Note that those improvement are more of a radical style so it would make sense to actually create fork of HOTA. Anyway here they are, each of them with some arguments pro:
-----------------------------------------------------------

1. the hero with more spell power gets to cast first
- logical - why does Tower heroes (the most magic oriented town) get cast almost always as second by default(they are limited by their troops speed)
- takes away the advantage of conflux phoenixes and fixes all kinds of imbalances



2. retreat only possible after surviving 2 rounds & the hero could be hired after 2 days
- logical (how can a hero without Town Portal teleport from the other side of the map? How can he also preserve his movement points?)
- gets to cancel this insane hacky practice with retrieving
- if DD and other thing are banned, why does not this get banned as well?

It seems to me that the whole multiplayer/advanced gameplay is based on a "buggy" feature but I might be missing a point here ^, so please if someone can explain me why the developers wanted this feature of retrieve how it is I would appreciate it.

3a. towns balancing

stronghold
- gets the mage guild lvl. 4
- since Behemots movement suck - they could at least be able to "jump" the castle ditch(not the wall)

fortress
- hydras should be much better
- all the units shall have much more hp!

if this ^ is not possible I would just remove the town all together - playing defensively can not win you anything in HOTA/HOMAM3

inferno
- gets some decent shooter


4. AI
- all AI shall be just of type explorer since this is the only type that can win you the game
- spells employed better by AI

3b. towns balancing

In general, all the creatures shall have 3rd of upgrade - so you are able to create more play with any town. so eventually al towns get ballanced. Example: Hydra could have more HP & Defense or more Movement & Speed


without the 3rd upgrade - it could also be, that second level upgrade you choose from 2 variants.
------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for feedback and stay safe:
sd0
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blob2
blob2


Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted February 11, 2021 03:33 PM
Edited by blob2 at 15:43, 11 Feb 2021.

sd0 said:

1. the hero with more spell power gets to cast first
- logical - why does Tower heroes (the most magic oriented town) get cast almost always as second by default(they are limited by their troops speed)
- takes away the advantage of conflux phoenixes and fixes all kinds of imbalances


You can always recruit a few Phoenixes to gain speed advantage Heroes 3 is also about mixing troops. Besides, the offset to their speed is their fragility. And some Tower troops have innate magic resistance, that's how they "balance" out the faction being slow. I remember winning some battles with AI when I was outclassed with spell power, but a Magic oriented hero couldn't finish off my Golems with his spells

sd0 said:
2. retreat only possible after surviving 2 rounds & the hero could be hired after 2 days


Do you mean how the AI abuses it? Part of the charm...

sd0 said:
It seems to me that the whole multiplayer/advanced gameplay is based on a "buggy" feature but I might be missing a point here ^, so please if someone can explain me why the developers wanted this feature of retrieve how it is I would appreciate it.


Would you also ban hero chaining then? There are mechanics that are "exploited" by the playerbase. Some find it annoying, some find it part of skillfully playing a game. I dislike AI popping up out of nowhere, but throughout the years I learned to play around it.

sd0 said:

3a. towns balancing
stronghold
- gets the mage guild lvl. 4
- since beholders movement suck - they could at least be able to "jump" the castle ditch(not the wall)


Uhm, what do Beholders have to do with Stronghold? Besides, they're ranged, they don't need big movement range.

sd0 said:
fortress
- hydras should be much better
- all the units shall have much more hp!

if this ^ is not possible I would just remove the town all together - playing defensively can not win you anything in HOTA/HOMAM3


Yeah, I don't like a town, let's remove it. Hydra is fine, it's a slow but hard to kill unit. Use Haste and it can massacre a whole cluster of units.

sd0 said:
inferno
- gets some decent shooter


Aren't Magogs considered one of the best 2nd level shooter? Inferno might not be balanced but it has it's strong points.

sd0 said:
4. AI
- all AI shall be just of type explorer since this is the only type that can win you the game
- spells employed better by AI


I don't remember if HotA team ever considered tweaking with the AI... besides I believe most of the veteran players, HotA team inculded, (so people who play HotA regulary) have moved to multiplayer and that's what interests them. Playing a campaign is for flavor and some occasional challenge.

sd0 said:
3b. towns balancing

In general, all the creatures shall have 3rd of upgrade - so you are able to create more play with any town. so eventually al towns get ballanced. Example: Hydra could have more HP & Defense or more Movement & Speed


Isn't adding more units the opposite of "balancing"? I think what you described leans more towards alternative upgrades? That said I highly doubt HotA team would ever add new units to existing town line-ups

I think most of the things you suggested HotA would never consider... judging by their additions so far.

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Treth
Treth

Tavern Dweller
posted February 11, 2021 04:07 PM

sd0 said:
3b. towns balancing

In general, all the creatures shall have 3rd of upgrade

Play third upgrades mod for Era.

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sd0
sd0

Tavern Dweller
posted February 11, 2021 04:59 PM
Edited by sd0 at 17:05, 11 Feb 2021.

reply got duplicated dunno why...
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sd0
sd0

Tavern Dweller
posted February 11, 2021 05:01 PM
Edited by sd0 at 17:04, 11 Feb 2021.

blob2 said:
sd0 said:

1. the hero with more spell power gets to cast first
- logical - why does Tower heroes (the most magic oriented town) get cast almost always as second by default(they are limited by their troops speed)
- takes away the advantage of conflux phoenixes and fixes all kinds of imbalances


You can always recruit a few Phoenixes to gain speed advantage Heroes 3 is also about mixing troops. Besides, the offset to their speed is their fragility. And some Tower troops have innate magic resistance, that's how they "balance" out the faction being slow. I remember winning some battles with AI when I was outclassed with spell power, but a Magic oriented hero couldn't finish off my Golems with his spells


Sure you can recruit them but imagine Tower agains Conflux both starting at opposite corners of the map - it wont be easy to capture the Conflux town, you will probably have to fight Conflux main before and thats where you would have the disadvantage I was talking about.



blob2 said:
sd0 said:
2. retreat only possible after surviving 2 rounds & the hero could be hired after 2 days


Do you mean how the AI abuses it? Part of the charm...

sd0 said:
It seems to me that the whole multiplayer/advanced gameplay is based on a "buggy" feature but I might be missing a point here ^, so please if someone can explain me why the developers wanted this feature of retrieve how it is I would appreciate it.


Would you also ban hero chaining then? There are mechanics that are "exploited" by the playerbase. Some find it annoying, some find it part of skillfully playing a game. I dislike AI popping up out of nowhere, but throughout the years I learned to play around it.


I also do not like AI dropping from nowhere thats bs right. But the main point was basically to just only change the retrieve function. I would not ban chaining since it is logical and I think is "skillful playing". So chaining good / retreat(now) bad.

Maybe it is you guys playing playing that way for a long time already and not noticing the "illogicalness" of it.


blob2 said:
sd0 said:

3a. towns balancing
stronghold
- gets the mage guild lvl. 4
- since beholders movement suck - they could at least be able to "jump" the castle ditch(not the wall)


Uhm, what do Beholders have to do with Stronghold? Besides, they're ranged, they don't need big movement range.


> Sorry I mean Behemots - my bad.


The rest of you answers does make sense - I think focussing on the AI does not make sense so much. And the upgrades might be too much of a change since we are looking for most ideal outcome over preferably minimal work
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Hourglass
Hourglass


Famous Hero
posted February 11, 2021 06:48 PM

sd0 said:


It seems to me that the whole multiplayer/advanced gameplay is based on a "buggy" feature but I might be missing a point here ^, so please if someone can explain me why the developers wanted this feature of retrieve how it is I would appreciate it.

Well, it's not exactly buggy or glitchy or anything like that. The method would be used even if the movement couldn't be spared. Sure, the developers maybe didn't intend it to be used in this scale, but then again, I'm not convinced that something like spamming slow was intentionally developed to be a dominating strategy. It's really just players trying to play with the best of their ability.  

sd0 said:

3a. towns balancing


Currently, only Inferno is (still) considered of being a clear underdog despite the format one is playing. For example Fortress and Stronghold have access to top tier hero classes Barbarian and Beastmaster.

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