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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Ideas and Suggestions This thread is 84 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 20 40 60 ... 80 81 82 83 84 · «PREV / NEXT»
P4R4D0X0N
P4R4D0X0N


Famous Hero
posted June 14, 2019 09:52 PM

Well i know a lot formulars i would put in an algorithm, but I fear nobody would agree with me

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Sparrow_Jack
Sparrow_Jack

Tavern Dweller
posted June 14, 2019 10:16 PM

Hello forum members and HotA crew!

As I watch multiplayer games on many templates, I see that Tower is preceived as the weakest of them all and people can pay even 7k for other town.
It's based mostly on weak units, slow terrain and terrible heroes.

First two aspects can't really be touched without significant balance changes, but heroes can, and I'd even say that they should.

I have a few suggestions that would make this faction a bit more powerful:

1. Lower the cost of hypnotize a bit(12/10 spell points for example) and make Astral's specialisation be +50%/100% to hypnotize power(like Ciele's/Luna's specialty)

2. Introduce/rework another hero, that would have specialisation in lightning bolt, that would make the hero start with the spell and cast it at half the price(5/4 spell points) - that would also allow other characters to learn the spell since most of them have scholar ability.

3. Make Theodorus start with a bunch of mages just like Bron does in Fortress(3-5 for example)

4. Change Theodorus' secondary skill from ballistics to archery
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revolut1oN
revolut1oN


Famous Hero
posted June 14, 2019 11:23 PM

Tower is weak only on Jebus.

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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 06:57 AM

Tower weak units, what?!

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Sparrow_Jack
Sparrow_Jack

Tavern Dweller
posted June 15, 2019 07:21 AM

phoenix4ever said:
Tower weak units, what?!


I'm not talking about titans and naga queens, but at the beginning - yes.

First week is usually really slow for Tower. Gremlins are your main powerstack and they can't deal with many obstacles and current Tower heroes don't help that much, since Solmyr is the only one that stands out and he's a glass cannon.
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 07:55 AM

Well yeah I guess downgraded gremlins, gargoyles and golems are pretty weak, but the first 3 downgraded units are pretty bad in most towns tbh. When you upgrade the gremlins you will probably do fine, also because you can get a lot of them. Stone Golems could also have had speed 4 instead of 3, 3 is extremely slow...

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Sparrow_Jack
Sparrow_Jack

Tavern Dweller
posted June 15, 2019 08:51 AM

I might be a bit biased by Jebus - that's true, but I don't really see how Tower could be of that much value on some poorer templates, if that is true - I'll gladly acknowledge that, for I like this town very much.

Yes, there is a lot of gremlins to be used at the beginning of a map, and upgrading them is usually the only way to be able to defeat some, not even that tough monsters. That's why it's usually a good idea to upg them on 1st day. Sadly due to their lack of shots (and building blacksmith + buying ammo cart slows down town progression) they can't evn clear churchyards.

Upg gargoyles are great for scouts and for kiting enemies, but they pack no punch (if you start with gergoyle specialst you can attack lowest pickets without much magic day 1/2 maybe, but it's still risky and you only have 1/2 of gremlins then)

Upgrading golems somewhere during 1st week is something I don't really see in games, there is too few golems to pack a decent punch anyway, and that +5hp for tanking isn't usually worth, when you can build naga dwelling 1 day faster.

On day 2 most other factions can have really powerful powerstacks, while Tower is stuck with gremlins till you buy nagas. Also it's the only town that has 3 shooters, but sadly they don't have any heroes with archery. (They have heroes with tactics, offence and armorer, so it's not like those might-oriented skills just don't fit there lore-wise imo)
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 09:01 AM

I have a feeling developers might have thought that Archery for Tower heroes would be OP. (Strange how they did'nt feel that about Town Portal, Dimension Door, Diplomacy, Necromancy, Conflux, Cloak of the Undead King, Wizard's Well, Angel Wings etc.)

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Sparrow_Jack
Sparrow_Jack

Tavern Dweller
posted June 15, 2019 09:22 AM
Edited by Sparrow_Jack at 09:36, 15 Jun 2019.

Hmm... you might be right about that, as it would boost the faction considerably. Their heroes also have low chances to get archery - who knows, maybe for the same reason.

But adding archery to a wizard (Theodorus, I know that ballistics makes more sense than archery) wouldn't be too OP I think, as wizards have low chances for attack skill(10%). Also when you can afford to build titans, you usually have also access to many other heroes, probably from other factions, that have far greater probability to have archery.

bloodsucker said:
Sparrow_Jack said:

I'm not talking about titans and naga queens, but at the beginning - yes.


Tower is strong from start, it's only slow development. If you upgrade all dwellings but mages immediately after you build them, everything but Obsidian Gargoyles is between the first four places for it's level.


I know they are strong in general, but it's exactly as you said - they have slow development and it's a part of this town, it's unique and I am not suggesting any changes to that(HotA crew already tweaked this town in that sense).
I'm just suggesting some slight boosts for heroes, for I think everyone can agree that (at least with current versions of skills like Mysticism or Eagle Eye) they are extremely underwhelming.


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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted June 15, 2019 09:41 AM
Edited by bloodsucker at 09:45, 15 Jun 2019.

Sparrow_Jack said:

But adding archery to a wizard (...) wouldn't be too OP I think, as wizards have low chances for attack skill(10%).

Yes, yes, yes. If one has to have ridiculous magic specialists for monks and mages at least make them start with Archery, that will give those creatures a push. But I still think they would be much more interesting to play if made Archery specialists.


Sparrow_Jack said:
Also when you can afford to build titans, you usually have also access to many other heroes, probably from other factions, that have far greater probability to have archery.

That was the path I was going to suggest but it's a bit sad that a level 1 Jabarkas is a better bet for Tower then Neela or Solmyr.
I would argue that when a strong town like Cove (and I bet also the new one) may have the excellent set of heroes it has, it makes no sense Tower is still burden with this old restriction that makes it have no Good starting hero. At least revert Neela Scholar to Tactics.
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 10:01 AM

I don't think Archery would fit a Wizard.(or any magic hero for that matter)
It could fit an Alchemist, but not sure if it would in fact be OP.
I don't think magic heroes should have had any creature specialties either, they should be reserved for might heroes.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted June 15, 2019 10:11 AM

phoenix4ever said:
I don't think Archery would fit a Wizard.

It's because it doesn't "fit" that I think they would make interesting heroes to play...
Obviously an Alchemist with Archery specialty could become an OP hero for Tower but not a Wizard or a Cleric. Those would become excellent only after a long path and if you were lucky enough to get them a reasonable development despise their awful skill trees. Interesting heroes to play, so.
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Sparrow_Jack
Sparrow_Jack

Tavern Dweller
posted June 15, 2019 10:19 AM

Phoenix is right - it doesn't fit, at least archery specialty isn't what I would choose, especially for wizards. Archery skill on the other hand - that would make slightly more sense and I don't really see explanations in hero descriptions why they have their secondary skill.

Unit specialties on the other hand - for me it depends entirely on hero description. It's his/her environment that shapes those specialties.

As I look at warlocks and wizards at the moment, I see that they both have not the best choices of secondary skills and have similar progression trees(I don't count the fact that earth>any other magic, since they will be reworked). So it's the specialties that make all the difference really as to why people like warlocks and hate wizards so much.
That is why I think that my suggestions make a bit more sense(about hypnotize and lightning bolt specialty) and shouldn't break the balance. Other ideas for creative specialties would definitely work in here too.
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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted June 15, 2019 10:53 AM
Edited by bloodsucker at 10:55, 15 Jun 2019.

I don't know about you but I only play SP and I like my mains to have a challenging start but end up completely OP and I can see that happening to this hypothetical Theodorus.
It wouldn't be the only one to have an unlikely specialty, just think on that heretic with Weakness specialty or the campaign witch that starts with Expert Fire.  
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 03:23 PM
Edited by phoenix4ever at 20:18, 17 Jun 2019.

Idea 1:
Is'nt it time we got a proper Golem Factory, on the adventure map, one that offers only Stone Golems like the other level 3 dwellings.
The current Golem Factory with all 4 golems could either cease to exist or offer only Gold and Diamond Golems.
A new dwelling for Gold Golems and one for Diamond Golems are also a possibility.

Idea 2:
A great new idea for a new adventure, level 3, Fire spell:
The new spell will act as a way of giving your slowest creatures in you army an improved "artificial movement speed", which applies only on the adventure map, making the hero move faster after this spell is cast. The spell needs to be cast one day and the following day the bonus will be applied. The spell can of course be cast every day, to save movement penalty.
Name: Currently not sure. Spell cost: 9/6/6/6
Unskilled/Basic level: All creatures with speed lower than 5 will now have speed 5 on the adventure map, the following day. (5 speed amounts to 1630 movement points.)  
Advanced level: All creatures with speed lower than 8 will now have speed 8 on the adventure map, the following day. (8 speed amounts to 1830 movement points.)
Expert level: All creatures with speed lower than 11 will now have speed 11 on the adventure, the following day. (11 speed amounts to 2000 movement points.)

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Gandalf196
Gandalf196


Known Hero
posted June 15, 2019 05:52 PM

Sparrow_Jack said:

As I look at warlocks and wizards at the moment, I see that they both have not the best choices of secondary skills and have similar progression trees(I don't count the fact that earth>any other magic, since they will be reworked). So it's the specialties that make all the difference really as to why people like warlocks and hate wizards so much.
That is why I think that my suggestions make a bit more sense(about hypnotize and lightning bolt specialty) and shouldn't break the balance. Other ideas for creative specialties would definitely work in here too.


You're almost correct, my friend, but you are forgetting one rather crucial point Warlocks scale like this from level 1-9: 10/10/50/30 and 20/20/30/30 from the tenth level on.
Wizards, however, have a very reasonable scaling in their first levels, 10/10/40/40, BUT ONCE THEY REACH LEVEL 10, their primary skill development becomes this blatantly obnoxious 30/20/20/30 (Yes, you read correctly, from the tenth level on, Wizards are more likely to improve their attack rating than their spell power..). Also, there's the fact that, despite having less knowledge, Warlock have got Mana Vortex, which is responsible for making them shine even in the spell points department. That is, they're objectively better mages than wizards, period (in fact, Wizard may be, currently, the worst of all magic classes). I am all for a change that would do justice to this classical archetype, make Wizards great again

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All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.

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bloodsucker
bloodsucker


Legendary Hero
posted June 15, 2019 06:17 PM
Edited by bloodsucker at 18:18, 15 Jun 2019.

@Phoenixforever It would be better to keep the actual Golem Factory as it is and make it neutral while just adding one dwelling for Stone Golems, don't you think?
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phoenix4ever
phoenix4ever


Legendary Hero
Heroes is love, Heroes is life
posted June 15, 2019 08:26 PM

@Bloodsucker Yeah I guess, but I don't really like that you can buy Iron Golems there, it's not like you can recruit upgraded creatures in any of the other dwellings.

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P4R4D0X0N
P4R4D0X0N


Famous Hero
posted June 18, 2019 06:42 PM

The mainproblem I see here, most heroes are kinda useless compared to other. In case of tower a hero with archery would be picked, same as Neela, Solmyr, Halon and maybe Fafner.

What I personaly hate about heroes in general are straight sec skills, like Leadership for all Knights, Scholar for all Genies, Archery for all Elves, Resistance for all Dwarfs e.g. I'd like more diversity in general on existing heroes and better fitting in a special role or niche. For Example Rewrite Alamar/Jeddite (Dublicate) for specialty in fire magic or something since Dungeon is predestined for Armageddon. Rewrite Thane for Archery since it's useful for tower. I would also like a complete remake for Witches and all Conflux heroes.

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fiur
fiur


Promising
Supreme Hero
Map Creator
posted June 22, 2019 08:20 PM

Larger BackPack

is there a way to make the backpack bigger than 64 ?
I tried to search for a sollution without any luck
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Hack and Slash....

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