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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted November 23, 2013 10:20 AM |
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Edited by Elvin at 10:22, 23 Nov 2013.
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The academy one is kind of obvious  I mean look at the demonlord's attack, of course he would go on and all-out charge. Generally gating vs academy is only safe if he does not have good offensive(luck/archery/battle frenzy), good spellpower or destructive/dark. If he has light/summoning then gating will pay off. Hell chargers and firehounds will of course still charge to block titans and spread their damage. If you realize that your units cannot be killed at a fast pace you can choose to gate after the charge, depending on the immediate threats and both heroes' atb.
And charging haven like that.. Yeah it can work but if you can neutralize his marksmen with seducers(or get them killed by vindicators) you can then take out haven at your leisure. His mana won't last long and he will be helpless against your dark so you have little reason to risk a frontal assault. You still risk the imperials diving on your pit spawns but it's a good risk.
Apart from the unit/hero atb, a big part of gating depends on the availability of spells like mass haste/endurance/suffering/confusion or vampirism so there are no consistent rules of when you should gate and when you should not. Hell Stallion, Firehound, Succubus and Arch Devil gating mostly depend on your board control.
So if you are saying that gating blindly at the beginning of a match is a bad idea you would be right. What I am saying is that gating is an excellent weapon if you create the right opportunities and time it right.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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zaio-baio
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 01:27 PM |
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Just had a game on that epic 1-Year-of-troops map. Here is the replay vs a fellow player on gameranger rep It's me, haven vs DeletedPlayer's inferno. He went for nymus + urgash's call, i had a typical hav build - maeve + light with all masteries, attack + retribution, leadership + empathy, defense + last stand and enlightenment. Also i had pendant of conflux + sar issus ring.
P.S thx for the map, it seems quite interestig.
@ DarkPrince
The more you wait, the higher the chance for your opponent to get the pendant of conflux offered in an art shop.
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Raelag84
Famous Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 06:32 PM |
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Any good youtube videos of dungeon fighting?
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 06:53 PM |
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zaio-baio said:
Just had a game on that epic 1-Year-of-troops map. Here is the replay vs a fellow player on gameranger rep It's me, haven vs DeletedPlayer's inferno. He went for nymus + urgash's call, i had a typical hav build - maeve + light with all masteries, attack + retribution, leadership + empathy, defense + last stand and enlightenment. Also i had pendant of conflux + sar issus ring.
P.S thx for the map, it seems quite interestig.
Here is my favorite duel map (10W).
http://www.mediafire.com/download/t82ik57hvc3vakw/10W_Small_1.96.h5m.zip
Small, infinite movement, almost no duplicate artifacts on two sides, super hero reinforcements for fighting Fortress, and many other features. BTW, Sphinx' answer is ywz.
Is there anyway to download files from speedy.sh without the exe file? I am hesitant to open exe files and that's why I use mediafire.com to store files.
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 06:59 PM |
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Elvin said:
So if you are saying that gating blindly at the beginning of a match is a bad idea you would be right. What I am saying is that gating is an excellent weapon if you create the right opportunities and time it right.
So we have some agreement here. There is players' discretion in the use of Gating, but my original claim would probably apply most of the time if you list all factions and all artifact possibilities.
Raelag84 said:
Any good youtube videos of dungeon fighting?
What kind of videos are you asking for? Just duels or normal maps?
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Raelag84
Famous Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 07:11 PM |
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darkprince said:
Raelag84 said:
Any good youtube videos of dungeon fighting?
What kind of videos are you asking for? Just duels or normal maps?
Duels
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 23, 2013 07:20 PM |
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted November 23, 2013 11:25 PM |
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Very proud of this one 
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Raelag84
Famous Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 01:14 AM |
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Elvin said:
Very proud of this one
That was awesome! Except Primus didn't seem to have detain destruction. What would you have done if he did? Also what was with Sinitar's first move?
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted November 24, 2013 10:19 AM |
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That's because shatter destructive is a mostly bad skill for orcs. If they have all might skills they want, they do not fear destructive. And if they do pick it and dungeon chooses dark or dark/summoning they are at a disadvantage. On the other hand dungeon knows that its destructive will likely not be enough so they have to focus fire on one orc stack to drain it of its rage quickly - or better yet attack it before it moves and gains any rage. Destructive may be shattered but deep freeze physical vulnerability and freeze or fireball's armour breaking effect will still work. Dungeon's units die fast so they have a small window of opportunity to do real damage and it's even worse when the orcs have bloodfire like Primus in this match.
Which is why the centaurs got lvl 1 rage at the beginning of the combat btw. When that happens the replay shows both heroes as if they were about to act but their turn is skipped and they play when they normally would. Just a replay bug.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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Raelag84
Famous Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 02:48 PM |
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Elvin said:
On the other hand dungeon knows that its destructive will likely not be enough so they have to focus fire on one orc stack to drain it of its rage quickly - or better yet attack it before it moves and gains any rage. Destructive may be shattered but deep freeze physical vulnerability and freeze or fireball's armour breaking effect will still work. Dungeon's units die fast so they have a small window of opportunity to do real damage and it's even worse when the orcs have bloodfire like Primus in this match.
Hmmm. It sound like in a battle of orcs vs dungeon making the first move is very important. If I was playing as ether faction I would consider swift mind.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted November 24, 2013 03:26 PM |
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Too risky, that's 4 less might skills and an expert luck or defense can change everything.
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 03:38 PM |
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Raelag84 said:
Hmmm. It sound like in a battle of orcs vs dungeon making the first move is very important. If I was playing as ether faction I would consider swift mind.
That's why Kragh was one of the two very best Barbarian heroes (the other being Haggash). Born Swift Mind, no skill points necessary.
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zaio-baio
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 03:39 PM |
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darkprince said:
That's why Kragh was one of the two very best Barbarian heroes (the other being Haggash). Born Swift Mind, no skill points necessary.
Russians ban for this 
P.S
How about Kraght with sandro's cloak waiting on his 1st action and then casting fear my roar before the opponents titans play 
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 03:42 PM |
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zaio-baio said:
Russians ban for this
It's funny that every H5 community has its own ban list, and the lists are quite different.
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Elvin
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
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posted November 24, 2013 04:11 PM |
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Last I recall Kragh's first action could only be a direct attack and not a warcry. And yes, Sandro's cloak + fear my roar was fun The moment when you cast vampirism on your phoenix and suddenly the opponent scares it. OH COME ON!
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H5 is still alive and kicking, join us in the Duel Map discord server!
Map also hosted on Moddb
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SKPRIMUS
Promising
Supreme Hero
The One and the Prime
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posted November 24, 2013 04:20 PM |
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both zaio-baio & darkprince refer to the game exploit bug for Kragh where waiting at beginning of battle means Kragh can instead do a warcry or whatever hero action he wants [bad, bad for even using it in real play]
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Hope defeats despair - "a blatant clue"
too many idiots in VW
"to lose is to win, and he who wins shall lose"
bashing orcus 
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darkprince
Adventuring Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 05:48 PM |
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SKPRIMUS said:
both zaio-baio & darkprince refer to the game exploit bug for Kragh where waiting at beginning of battle means Kragh can instead do a warcry or whatever hero action he wants [bad, bad for even using it in real play]
I wouldn't call that an exploit
You wait and lost half your action bar--that's all. Many units with high initiatives can be faster than a waited Kragh (even his own units like Chieftains).
As an opponent, I'll let you do that Battle Cry / Fear (first you need to have those) and so what? Kragh has a harder time creeping early game compared to Haggash, Telsek, and sometimes even worse than Urghat/Gorshak/Garuna.
zaio-baio and I were discussing 4 times normal growth paladins/champions earlier. Every faction has some tricks. It would be a very long list of things to ban.
The tricks that I believe worth banning are:
1. Creeping with Arcane Crystal to immobilize AI action. I would consider it acceptable if AI keeps moving while the crystals are up.
2. Goblin knight.
3. Blade Barrier / Last-stand vampirism on some maps but not all.
4. Some heroes with a big advantage on certain maps (e.g., Havez on small maps, Wyngaal on big maps). Kragh is strong on big maps, but so is Haggash (more likely to be imba with lv2 dwellings). No fun to ban so many heroes.
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Raelag84
Famous Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 06:58 PM |
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Is Sinitar on any ban list? I always thought he was a little overpowered.Not majorly, but a little.
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zaio-baio
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted November 24, 2013 07:13 PM |
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Raelag84 said:
Is Sinitar on any ban list? I always thought he was a little overpowered.Not majorly, but a little.
Dont worry, he is not.
P.S About that 4x paladin thing - what do you guys think is stronger - 12 magmas + 24 thanes with all runes or 13 archangels + 101 paladins? (Max possible numbers week 8 with starting town lvl 2) Note that the haven side will have better might stats due to the knights higher chance to get att + def on lvl up.
Edit: Math was kinda off
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