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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: HOMM3 Tactics
Thread: HOMM3 Tactics [ This thread is 51 pages long: 1 2 (3) 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 ]
notmytohhandle
notmytohhandle


Known Hero
posted December 02, 2002 08:04 PM

Grrrr the pictures of my hard work keep dissapering from now and then.

Had a last try at making the pictures work, I wont try to make em work anymore so if they fail now, this is where u can c them.

http://www.photofun.com/IM/Templates/PhotoAlbum.cfm?Username=ARCHIE&RollID=73011

http://www.photofun.com/IM/Templates/PhotoAlbum.cfm?Username=ARCHIE&RollID=73012

/Archie
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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted December 02, 2002 09:36 PM
Edited By: Nebuka on 2 Dec 2002

I was bored so I made pics for Frank's Crypt tactic...

Hope I played them good...

Start

Centaurs killing skels, and moving single centaurs to draw vampires and wights attention

Moved GE's in corner and moved single centaur to lure vampires who'll be in full GE's damage range next turn

Large centaur stack prepares to finish Walk.Deads

Soon the 'death' of vampires...

...and wights

Yay!

We hoped for Bird of Perception...but this is good also...


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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted December 02, 2002 11:18 PM
Edited By: Nebuka on 3 Dec 2002

Destro, about your tactic with sprites...how you do it?

I mean, when I entered topia, drags attacked immidiately strongest sprite stack so i was left with nothing...

And motor, those dragons are scared of my demons, they attack sultans and pit lords instead...

And...

Here is mine contribution to tactics(or is this strategy?).

It's about getting second and third town as well as all mines on day 2 on Hourglass 3 map(SOD version). I know most of you already know all of this but maybe some newbies don't, as I didn't. Many thanks to Joel who thought me this...

Ok, here we go...

I went all random and got Tower and Solmyr as hero.

Now bought Iona, gave her fastest unit, and she grabbed stables, wood mill with woods and gold mine as well as gold around. And let she be there for a while.

Now with Orrin went for ore mine and placed him near sulfur mine. Don't forget to visit stables with every hero! And give all of them single unit which is fastest.

Got Deemer and moved him all the way to east. He'll be our first fighter.

Now Gerwolf comes to play too. Move him all the way to west. He'll be last fighter.

Lovely Mirlanda goes little bellow crystal mine. As long she's near it, it's ok.

Ash goes beetwen Orrin and Deemer for transportation of troops from one to another. Deemer can't make it all the way to Orrin.

And with Solmyr grab resources, artifacts or whatever is there, then return him to castle and let him wait next turn.

Now the fun starts! It's new day and Solmyr bought all available troops and transfer them to Deemer.

Deemer killed hell hounds, took town, resources and artifact, then gave troops to Ash. Remember to give arts too, some morale boosters greatly help.

Ash, wanting to fight too, killed first wights who were guarded blackshard sword, and then gave troops to Orrin. Sword always helps.

Orrin claimed sulfur mine, gem pond, and killed crystal mine guards. Then Mirlanda took his troops.

Iona had to move a bit to take Mirlanda's troops, who succesfully destroyed resistance at Alchemist Lab.

Gerwolf also had to move a bit to take troops, but do not worry, he can make it! (This was my mistakes, but even with them I made it)

In this pic, there were pack of orcs guarding town...forgot to take that pic. But you can see Gerwolf made it! He rules. More than Piquedram.

And this is reward you get. All mines...well not all, there are also two abandoned mines above...and you get capitol day 2! Three castles with town halls and gold mine...


There it is. I think this is it. Some veterans would proly do this more efficient, with less losses and better placing of heroes, but I think you get the picture what to do. With this tactic(strategy?) go to Hourglass XXL and grab all five towns day 2!


One more...

Here you can see pics of another Frank's tactic, the one about level 6 units vs archers...

Valeska with 0 experience and two cavaliers.

First cavaliers waits.

All of the magogs shot lower cavalier.

Then advance to them...

...and again to strike them. I recommend that you strike lower ones first so you can retaliate to stronger stack

Almost all of the magogs went to lower cavalier but he has enough hit points to live and let live...i mean die.

Now the magogs went to upper cavalier thinking if he has more hp he'll die soon. Magogs are dumb, they're not imps.

Finishing...

Ta Da!



I tried this vs lots of orc chieftans, lizard warriors and archers, as well vs pack of elves, and it works...tried agains lots of beholders but failed, two are not enough...

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notmytohhandle
notmytohhandle


Known Hero
posted December 03, 2002 07:02 PM
Edited By: notmytohhandle on 3 Dec 2002

i think the lvl6 tactic vs ranged units is best applied on randed units with melee penelty.

Uhm dont try zelots either .)

I tried to edit the randed to ranged but in edit mode it says ranged allrdy.. weird

/Nasty Archie
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Sir_Stiven
Sir_Stiven


Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
posted December 04, 2002 07:40 PM

Quote:

@notmytohhandle

11 7 2 8, great stats for 2nd week

You havent played the archtosser yet i see =)

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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 04, 2002 09:50 PM

9) Scouting wars

On open maps the scouting war is very important.  You have to find a way to see your opponent`s land and prevent your opponent from scouting your land.  If you can achieve that early in the game it`ll be much easier for you in the later stages of the game.

First thing first.  Knowing the scouting tactics will benefit you the most if you know the map perfectly.  Focuss on knowing which path is the shortest to get to a specific area.  Know approximately where the red zone is.  By red zone I mean the area of the open map in which fights can occur if both players starting on day 1 send a scout strait towards the enemy.  You have to know the basics about HOMM troops such has unit`s speed on all type of lands, dwarfs' potential to resist magics, fire elementals` immunity against magic arrows, etc...


How to create a good scout.  There are 3 ways to setup a good scout.
1) a very fast scout with either pathfinding /logistic / 1-4 native land troop.  Examples: piquedram with gargoyles on the map battle for honor.  Knowing which area of the map you can reach with no chance of getting attacked by your opponent is the key.

2) A loaded in hit points hero.  Use all your dwarfs or zombies.  This type of scout will be slow getting to the red zone (zone in which fights can occur) but once there chances are you will have the edge against your opponent`s scouts.

3) A strong magic user.  7 fast troops on an hero with at least 2 knowledge and 2 spell power can also be good.  If you take into account your type of castle vs the castle your opponent, you can improve the potential of such a scout.  Example: you are rampart and your opponent is tower on grass terrain map.  Your centaur will have 7 speed whereas your opponent`s gargoyles will have 6.  So such a scout will work even better having the first and last decision in any fights with your opponent`s scouts.  

Combination of the 2nd and 3rd type of scout is the best to kill your opponent`s scouts.

Whichever type of scouts you use you must use a global scouting strategy.  Remember that the prime objective isn`t to kill your opponent`s scouts.  Your objective is to scout most of your opponent`s land while preventing your opponent to do exactly that.   So if you win a fight between scouts, chances are that if you continue deeper into your enemy land, you won`t win the next fight...  So I suggest that you withdraw by returning towards your main castle in such a position that you can link more troops to your scout in case your opponent choses to run after you.

This is the hardest part of any games on open maps.  You have to develop a main hero but meanwhile each heroes you use must have access to the core of your army in case you need it to stop the progression in your land of enemy scouts.  I don`t want to be too specific but try forming a grid of heroes, each of them active (doing stuff), so that if ever your opponent tries something radical, you can counter his every moves.




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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 05, 2002 06:55 PM

10) Chests - gold or experience points?

In a multiplayer game, given a fair map, you can count on one thing: both players will have access to roughly the same quantity of gold.  If you take some of your gold as xps (experience points) for your main hero it shouldn`t jeopardize the best line of buildings for your main castle at least for the first week.

The ratio by which you get xps is different for all possible chests.  2000 gold chest gives 1500 xps or 75% of it`s value.  1500 gold chest gives 1000 xps or 67% of it`s value and 1000 gold chest gives 500 xps or 50% of it`s value.  Personnaly I take almost only 2000 chests for xps and rarely 1500 in some key situations.

Why would you need xps from a chest?  There are some situations in which taking xps from a chest can help you gather even more gold for the given week than you would have if you took gold instead of xps.  If you recognize those situations than you are clearly managaging gold vs main hero build vs caslte build in a great way.

Examples of those situations:
- 2 chests are behind lots marksmen.  Your hero has expert offence, advanced tactic and needs only 1000 xps for the next level.  If expert tactic means that your unit can reach the marksmen in the first combat turn thus avoiding massive losses than you really should take a chest for xps instead of gold.
- For any logistic heroes like Pyre, Gunnar, Dessa and Kyrre.  Getting expert logistic sooner means more distance covered the next turn and so in the end, your main hero will open access to more gold than he would have if you didn`t take xps from earlier chests.
- If a fight between main heroes with full army is about to happen, you have an advanced secondary skill such as air or earth magic with the related good spells, than you have to take xps from chests to get expert level.  2000 gold worth of gnolls isn`t nearly as beneficial for you than gaining the ability to cast mass haste, mass slow, mass shield, etc...

In any case, chests taken as experience points make a greater difference early in the game.  In the later stages, when your main hero requires 5000 xps to get a new level, gold should solely be used to buy all the troops you can.  

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Motorschaaf
Motorschaaf


Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
posted December 06, 2002 12:21 AM

the kind o tactics i wanna describe now are different. they are not battlefield ,chaing tactics or similar. its more about how to use little psychology tricks to get an advantage or turn a game around.

i know a lot players might disagree with me but i have made good experience with this strange tactics.

- show what u got.
i know  alot players who try to hide their stats by taking off arts before the end of every turn. i think this is an huge mistake. not only that it costs time (and we all know that sometims every second counts ). no ! also there is the chance that u will be caught with all ur arts in backpack and they dun help any further in there. but the main thing is -  seem to react more nervous and play much more unconcentrated if u show them an relic for example u found. i noticed that by myself when i saw an opponnt for example on day 9 with power 16 on hack that i tended to risk too much and then made some game deciding mistakes i wouldnt have done without having seen that cuirass on hack.
i think u automatically think that u are way behind - i also mean this is a reason for a lot suicides. even if u badly suck that game. by making ur opponent think u are ahead of him u can often turn the game around and force him to make mistakes.
same goes for scholars in my opinion. when i got a guy like alamar i usually never hide him. why u ask ? very simple - to scare the snow out of my opponnet. opponents often automatcally thinks ull have a great game without any trouble and that causes this unfoced errors like i said bfore- i bet everybody noticed that by himself when he saw day 1 his opponnet got alamar and with this a free resurect.
to be true - i often give alamar all troops by end of day 1 to inetentinally make him shown in tavern.
but this i only recommend on closed maps cause this res spell helps a lot with breaking garrisons and so. on open maps its more important to show ur opponents guys like deemer and solymr - the threat of getting rushed if often more effective than the rush itself

- tossing about ur game.
never ever whine in a game and tell how much u suck and what a bad game you have to expect the opponnet underestimates you. that usually has the opposite effect as u want it to have.

alamarschaaf

P.S: one tip i wanna ad as a tactic which alot playes seem to forget before entering a battle. allways keep an eye on which ground a battle takes place. that speed+1 for native ground can be a matchwinner !!



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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 06, 2002 08:12 AM

11) Building tactic with rampart and dungeon.

On most maps you will find that it`s possible to build the dragon dwelling on day 7.  But instead of getting that dwelling level 7 wouldn`t it be better to build up to level 6 dwelling with citadel and castle but without 2 levels of magic guild?  Compare the following troop quantities stats on day 8 for the 2nd option over building dwelling 7:

Bonus troops on day 8:
Rampart
+14 centaurs/+16 dwarfs/+7 elves/+5 pegasis/+5 dendroids/ +2 unicorns *
That`s 872 hit points worth of troops that you gain.  Is one green dragon worth it?
Dungeon
+14 trogs/+8 harpies/+7 beholders/+4 medusas/+3 minotaurs/ +2 manticores *
That`s 746 hit points worth of troops that you gain.  Is one red dragon worth it?

* no legion parts nor special buildings involved.

Of course fighting with 2 dragons on day 8 with your main hero is very effective.  Your main hero is fast having speed 10 for green dragon and speed 11 for red dragon, he can do just about any fights rather effortless.  But simplistic fights come at a high price.  Too high if you ask me.  6 war unicorns can be just has effective as 2 greens.  As for serpicores it involves 5 extra sulfurs which you may not have in abundance considering you still need 24 sulfurs to build your dragon dwelling in week 2...  Try fighting with manticores and minotaurs instead.

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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 07, 2002 04:00 PM
Edited By: Frank on 7 Dec 2002

12) Dragons

Dragons are amongst the mightiest creatures in HOMM.  They have great spead, nice def and att stats, they are immune to the first 2 levels of magics and most of all, they attack on 2 hexes distance...

Here are some tips on using dragons to the best of their abilities.
- Against AI (Arteficial Intelligence) controlled creatures.
The computer controlled troops will always use your own dragons retaliation against you if you let them have a proper hex and orientation from which to attack your dragons.  Usually you don`t need a lot of planning to avoid that.  However in fly hives and topias, if you are using green or red dragons, chances are you will get hit by your own dragons if you are careless placing your army before entering those areas.

- Against lower level monster groups you can take advantage of the 2 hexes attack by being patient.  Wait until 2 groups are lined up and then attact both groups via the smallest one to avoid any undue retaliation damage.  Avoid getting hit by all groups in the same combat turn.  Just one dragon can be amazing against slow groups.  Against faster and tougher groups like pack efreet you may want to use more than just one gold dragon because the outcome will be desastrous.  In single playing mode you`d just look silly.  In multiplaying mode, you may lose the game because of it.   But don`t despair, if you do such a stupid move, you can always pretend you didn`t do it by forcing a reload (!).

- Against your opponent
In main fights if you know that you don`t have the initiative (first move in the fight) you should place your dragons accordingly.  There are several ways to place your dragons so that your opponent can`t use them on your own troops.  Practice makes perfect.  

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Bad_Boxa
Bad_Boxa


Adventuring Hero
Bulgarian Azure Dragon
posted December 11, 2002 12:45 PM

Quote:
Every now and then I will post a tactic here.  Most of you will find some of them tactics obvious.  Hopefully I can share with you some other less obvious tactics that you will find helpfull.

1) Gold management and building tactic with rampart.

There is a building I`ve seen few Rampart addict ever build.  I do it every games that last 3 weeks+.   The Treasury building.  5000 gold 5W 10Ore might seem a lot but if you do all that you should do you will get 5K + gold the very first week change it comes into play.  Day 7 you should build a market in every cities you own.  Trade every ressources you don`t need.  Let`s say you are playing a random XL map and you have 100 gems-sulfur-mercury to trade.  Depending on the number of markets you own that`s easily +15k gold before the new week.  Also do not upgrade your green dragon dwelling just now, wait until day 1.  In fact, all major expenses should wait until the next day with the exception of going to a new month.  You can still gamble it but plagues may occur every other new months and so you might consider buying all that you can to save as much as possible.  Week 3 should be your goal to build the treasury else I suggest you wait until week 5 unless you want to gamble it.


Frank if this is for 100% diff I too thinks so in the most cases but if it is for some other kind of diff there is nothing the same about the rampart we can talk about it.
Btw. Do you know how to get in the UTOPIA withouth any loses of Grand Elves?And do you know how to eneter with Necromaser in UTOPIA only with skeletons at 3 week and the drogons to hit only the 1 skeleton not to hit the big group?

]:Agresion come back to you:[ aka.Boxa
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Agression Comes Back To You

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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 11, 2002 04:14 PM
Edited By: Frank on 11 Dec 2002

Well first of all boxa, the idea of this tread is sharing, not competing.  

There are several ways not too lose grand elves in topia, one being discussed by Archie in this very thread...Personnaly my technic is different but just as efficient: I don`t bring my grandelves in !  

Enter topia with only squeletons week 3?  Yeah I guess I know how to do it, I simply wait an extra week before I enter...  

In my own opinion, altough it`s true the starting difficulty makes AI act and react differently, t`s more practical to use/make tactics that works at any difficulties.

Remember that whereas there is always one best way to do any fights, you just know that only one morale can screw it all up.


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Bad_Boxa
Bad_Boxa


Adventuring Hero
Bulgarian Azure Dragon
posted December 11, 2002 04:41 PM

Ofcours Frank that it is not a competition but i just whant to learn some new things i usualy play 200% at random map and i eneter at utopia with grand elves and i have no loses.I just whant to say that at 200% is much more hard and everything depends from the map I realy think that you'r tactics's are good but you are right one moral may snow up the all game.:]]]]]]]]]

ak.Boxa

Agresion Come Back To You

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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 11, 2002 05:05 PM
Edited By: Frank on 11 Dec 2002

13) Units fighting order in a combat.

You`d be suprise how often in a game my opponent sends me a message like this: why are you playing first!???

The fighting order is relatively simple... if no spells and no morale are invovled !  If you aren`t using versions 1.4 - 2.2 - 3.2 - 4.0, this topic isn`t for you.  Tactic was working right in the previous versions and so upgrade your versions or read another topic.  

a) There is 2 part in any combat turns.  The downward part and the wait part.  In the downward part units play accordingly to their own speed.

b) Units that gets morale in the downward part and wait instead of moving will all play firts beginning the wait part starting from the first unit that got moral and not on a speed basis.  This is important.  If slow, haste or prayer is cast on a unit that wait on the downward part it`ll change the order in which they will play in the wait part but not on units that wait after having morale in the donward part !   I hope you are still with me.  

c) Most suprises comes when the 2nd turn begins especially when one player casted either blind or slow with 1 sp.   If your attacking opponent started the first turn with a unit of equal speed of your fastest unit, casting slow or blind having 1 sp on the opponent`s fastest unit will make your opponent play first again in the 2nd combat round !  That is unless your opponent had 2 units moving at that same fastest speed and both opponents had 7 different groups starting the combat and that none of the groups that waited on the downward part died before the wait part begun !

d) In a none castle fight, siege engines will ALWAYS have their turn to play at the end of the downward part and before troops with morale that waited get their turn.  That is important if you fight against an opponent equipped with a first aid tent.  If you can`t kill a unit completely, wait on the wait part in order to avoid the tent`s healing power.

{I know tossers will rejoice at seing that last commment, lot of tossing material in there for you... Know that in games in which 1st week fights happens, the first aid tent can be decisive in a fight.  So there.  }

e) The above is true for a fight against a castle with a few exceptions.  The first one to play in such a fight are the turrets if the defending hero as artillery as a secondary skill.  The skill is important here, not the ballista.  Don`t buy a ballista on a none artillery hero thinking that will grant you first move !  If no such hero is defending then it`s the attacker's catapult.  There is something interesting here.  If the attacking hero has ballistics and the defending hero doesn`t have artillery it will grant you the right of casting first even if your opponent has the fastest unit in the combat.  If solmyr is defending, deemer will be very pleased to cast first in each combat rounds hey Troelen ?  

Knowing when each units will have their turn in a combat is essential if you want to have any success in a multiplayer game.  When you know all that you think about such technic as casting slow on a blinded unit so that all your units can hit and hopefully kill the last standing unit to keep your opponent from having a say in the fight.  You can also be more effective attacking wraiths and wights inflicting all damage after those units used the regenerating abilities on the downward part in vain.  Same thing goes for trolls in SOD or complete...

I just got complete and I didn`t play AB much before that so if there are some of you experts out there I would like to see more tactics posted here about the creatures we don`t see in 1.4 like rust dragons, enchanters and such...


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Frank
Frank


Promising
Known Hero
posted December 11, 2002 05:40 PM
Edited By: Frank on 11 Dec 2002

14) How to play with Necropolis

Hopefully I will get the real expert on the subject to post a beneficial to all of us tactic topic about playing Necropolis...

I can already tell you things not well known about necropolis.

1) Squeleton transformers can provide you with bone dragons if you put in it any type of hydras and dragons !  Chaos, red, green, gold, black, azure if you wish... will provide you with bone dragons.

2)Vampire lords can only drain hit points from living things!  That means, don`t enter a fight with 10 vampires lords against horde water elemental... or any elementals.  Tower has some none living troops too like gargoyles and golems.  Of course you can`t drain any necro troops either.  So if your vamps depends on draining to win a fight, chose your targets wisely.

3) Ghost dragons can`t age troops that vampires can`t drain...  

ok TIM554 now it`s your turn... I want to see 4) 5) 6) 7) etc)...


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LordRiton
LordRiton


Known Hero
posted December 12, 2002 02:28 AM

4)  don't lose ur time with skeletons, they slow down ur movements, and are finally not that strong, even if you have hordes of em  I remember, i always went with Vampire Lords, Dreath knights and Ghost Dragons only in past..  when i still played this game  

5) No need of Skeletons, meens no need of Necro specific char, someone like "Crag Hack" at higher levels will do GREAT with Vampire Lords, you will be able to take a lower level Utopia with only a handfull V Lords without losing one

Salut Frank!  je passais par l  

A+
Lord Riton


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Sorry for my miserable english, i'm french.

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Nebuka
Nebuka


Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
posted December 12, 2002 03:24 AM

Quote:
4)  don't lose ur time with skeletons

Quote:
5) No need of Skeletons, meens no need of Necro specific char


My whole world just crashed...

So, Colonel was pretty good title when you played?
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Hexa
Hexa


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted December 12, 2002 10:48 AM

LOL I was baffeled as well Nebuka.

I would like to play him then necro war and see who well his vamps act against my legiona of skellies.

Use vamp lords on 3 or 4 heroes with exp. necro to harvest more skellies (sorry guess we all knew that huh? )
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If you want to realize your dreams >>> you have to wake up!@

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chubby051
chubby051


Promising
Known Hero
King of All That Are Fat
posted December 13, 2002 02:39 AM

Sorry, kinda off topic

I can't see any of the pics on this post.  Could somebody help me out with fixing this?

Chubbs
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Trees Grow Taller in the Shade

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bjorn190
bjorn190


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
posted December 13, 2002 05:07 AM

Quote:
How to play with necro



Alright..
4) try to take many 2nd towns and build 1st and sometimes 2nd dwellings out so they produce alot, then buy those troops and bring to the skel transformer. Might add an extra 500 to your skels.

5) Play using Isra, Vido or Galthran. My favourite is Galthran as main and Vido as collector.

6) In the main fight, always wait with your skeleton legion, to aviod the awsome power of the first aid tent!! That can make or break a game..

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